When I was in high school, the guidance counselor used to speak really scornfully about easy electives like "underwater basket weaving" but I have contemplated this for 35 years, and I still think underwater basket weaving sounds really hard.
When I was in high school, the guidance counselor used to speak really scornfully about easy electives like "underwater basket weaving" but I have contemplated this for 35 years, and I still think underwater basket weaving sounds really hard.
I cannot believe this thing is still going. Godspeed, you wild horses.
My brother drowned weaving a basket. Its hard on the family also.
My high school teacher used to talk about underwater basket weaving too. Like where did this study come from, and can people really major in it? I want to meet one person who has studied it. Bet they are fascinating.
My local community college has offered an underwater basket weaving class for decades. I think my mom took it, probably in the early 70s
Hahahaha, very clever!
Yeah I remember underwater basket weaving… tho as long as the basket is the only thing underwater… I really wonder where the idea came from
Plus, you’d get an interview anytime someone looked at your resume if it said “Actually took underwater basket weaving”
Especially 2nd semester when you have to hold your breath.
I hear it’s a preliminary degree to underwater welding
Once, at a job, when I was in my 20s, I made a joke to my coworkers about how X was easy like basketweaving. A male coworker with a sad countenance, looked at me, and said, “my (beloved) mom weaves baskets.” Never again did I crack jokes about basket weaving.
Are they underwater baskets that you're weaving, or are you weaving normal baskets while underwater? I've wondered about this for years.
That’s ALOT of skillsets. Underwater demolition or whatever the reverse is. Concentration. Building up lung strength. Physics on how you are able to fight the forces of the water against you. That’s Legit navy SEALS training stuff!
Sounds harder than being a guidance counselor..
Real
And more enjoyable...
I never paid my high school guidance counselor any mind. He wasn’t too bright.
If one had a snorkel or scuba for air... Would it keep the canes wet & more supple to weave? 🤔😎
Yes! Let's get to the heart of the practical questions. And also, does it make a difference to the canes if it is salt water or fresh water?
A basket weaver once told me salt acts as a preservative. Woodworm supposedly doesn't attack wicker soaked in seawater.
God if I had a dollar for every time I heard about that class in college I’d be retired.
I always thought the same thing. 😂
I just listened to a recent @ologies.bsky.social episode about it, very interesting!
Afaik there was one university in Washington state that offered a course in basket weaving as an elective in the Anthropology department, at some point in the 80s or 90s. And the fascist has been whining about it to justify education cuts and vilify the academcy every since then.
Yep. It became a meme for boomers to regurgitate at GenX.
Basket weaving and textiles is incredibly important to human development and civilization. It would make sense in an anthropology department. But anti-intellectualism crossed wit sexism ...
At a minimum you’d think it would matter to conservatives who want to preserve traditional homemaker values in the face of modernization.
They don't any to preserve traditional homemaker values. They want to entrap women. The modernization they fear is equality and equity.
Word. It's never been about any kind of tradition. Fascism raises a call to a lost golden age that never existed, built out of foggy childhood memories and really really silly readings of religious and mythological texts. It's all made up to appeal to the libido of miserable people .
They actually don’t care about anything to do with homemaking, they happily sneer at the housework their wives and mothers do yet expect a hot meal to be ready for them.
It's definitely more widespread than that. Sierra College in California has offered an underwater basket weaving class for decades
That's a follow haha
this sounds like one of the electives from community
LADDERS! *enthusiastic applause*
You've got to get the b breathing j u s t r I g h t.
there's something to be said about implying that studying a particular discipline is just a means towards a comfortable schedule and good grades, and not about learning the material.
I got a BFA in Underwater Basket Weaving.
I've always wondered if the whole process takes place under water...like you plus materials, or is it just in a sink or something.
:-)
That's going to be a high priority job when we no longer have power and the southern states are flooded!
Does it help your mental health and how do you basket weave with scuba equipment on? The mind boggles.
Only the basket-weaving part has to be underwater--soaking keeps the reeds flexible!
It was a little joke about scuba diver doing basket weaving.
Relevant podcast featuring a very cool canistrumologist: www.alieward.com/ologies/cani...
Probably tougher than my women's studies class!
i always just heard basket weaving.
I couldn't do it. You'd have to be a mermaid I think, or an octopus.
I always imagined this happening at like the deep end of a public pool but recently learned you just put your arms into a deep sink or something, you don’t even need a snorkel
that is so disappointing
Why was this always the go-to example? That’s the exact class my own teachers used to use to warn us to pick a good major lest we leave college with a degree in underwater basket weaving. And this was back in the days before the internet was as big as it is now…
You need scuba training and gear for starters.
This is very true, extremely hard...
As an undergraduate I took sculpture as my easy A. In my entire university career it was the only class I dropped.
Being able to weave a basket is a useful skill.
Hence the "underwater" part.
If you can do it underwater that just shows a degree of expertise at being able to make a craft.
That doesn't make it useful to do underwater.
Might be more fun to weave while swimming. I haven’t tried. 🤷🏻♂️😂 I’m also not familiar with the hypothetical course content. So I can’t say the role the water would play. But presumably yes, the idiom for being a waste of time would be a waste of time. Basket weaving isn’t though.
I will stand on business here. It’s not outright useful, but compared to other skills it is lower in priority. In the same way someone who can recite digits of pie has a skill that is not necessarily useful
If you can weave a basket that’s a relaxing and productive hobby. You can make something useful. You can make a gift for someone. That’s a beautiful thing. That’s like saying knitting is useless. A bought scarf isn’t the same as a one made for you.
Yeah, but as a college major which was the example we used…?
The example was for a high school elective? Which tends to be things like art, music, career and technical classes. I understand the idiom is used to describe degrees that are considered useless. I’m just saying being able to make a basket is a worthwhile pursuit.
But why doing that underwater?..
The plant materials baskets are made out of generally need to be soaked in order to be flexible enough to weave with. (It's not saying that the basket *weaver* also has to be underwater.)
Then wouldn't it be called *wet* basket weaving?
Just in case you haven’t heard it before. Underwater basket weaving is an idiom to describe classes or degrees that are considered useless.
How do you keep dry materials wet for the extended length of time it takes to make a basket?
About as useful as learning to use a slide rule.
"lower in priority" to a system setup to increase the wealth of the immorally rich at the expense of the majority of us whose labor it exploits. Skills are de-prioritized unless somehow construed to feed the economically immoral status quo which is all too often propagandized as "progress"
and all of that is unsustainable even to those teetering at the top in their misguided belief that -- they are winning at anything other than an incredibly immoral & myopic game; or that taking is better than giving.
Maybe not with scuba gear. You have to soak the materials for weaving baskets anyway.
It's a girl/boy scout badge if I'm not mistaken.
And yet, what would be the point?
Did we have the same guidance counselor? He also blew me off when I asked for help in figuring out how to apply for colleges and find/fill out scholarships. Yay for shitty counselors. Thankfully, the librarians were far more helpful.
when I was at university, I took swimming as an elective. Holy crap. It was so hard and the final was treading water for 45 minutes as well as other activities. Yes, we had a final. I took an acting course as an elective. Oh my God, the amount of work I had to do, papers I had to write.
They’re still all talking about underwater basket weaving. I didn’t know it was *a thing*
Personally I don't think guidance counselors should be speaking scornfully at all. Their job is to inspire.
Is it though?
Time to let it go. But don’t be scornful. The guidance counselor misspoke. The weave is a difficult thing to do.
I have tried basket weaving and I found it to be difficult even out of the water.
I've woven several baskets, and I can tell you that while the reeds need to be wet, doing the actual weaving under water would be impossible. I remember my high school guidance counselor saying that exact same thing. As a weaver I find it both validating and insulting to be dismissed like that.
😂 😂
I did, too, and made a whole lot of fun about this 'course'.
When I was in high school, the only electives for girls were cookery and sewing. For the boys, it was woodworking and metalwork. The girls weren't allowed to do the boy's electives. Underwater basket weaving would have been a sell-out course!
Both the weaving and the being under water. Not easy. My grade school guidance counselor apparently killed himself. Long after I was gone so it wasn’t because of me. That time.
LOL
I'm not sure that's an issue anymore, it seems they are preoccupied teaching a new way to add numbers, and replacing writing with tablet 101. 🙄
Given that it's the basket that is underwater, and not you, means the reeds/fibers they're using are really really stiff, so it probably is hard. Plus you're probably visually impaired from the water and your own movements.
As a person who has made multiple baskets.. it ain’t as easy as people think.
Seriously, though. If you take electives that teach a skill or a trade, that can be your gateway to not starving through a bad job market. Make baskets, do joinery, engage in metal work, weld... Those are the essential workers AI can't replace. I am an unemployed writer in his 40s with no skills....
And is the basket under water or is this a pool/goggle/snorkel situation ?
😂🤣😂👍🏼mine used to bitch me out for skipping classes and then going to the barn to get my horse and ride it in the football field 😂🤣😂
Actually I thought my useless engineering courses turned out to be the most useful.
I always wanted to try it, at least.
LOL funny but so true
The high school guidance counselor scoffed at useless degrees? As important as guidance counselors SHOULD be, in the modern US they are, in all likelihood, the least productive people in that building. And I'm counting all of the potential stoner burnouts in that list.
Mine told me not to do my A levels because I'm not that academic. I have a master's degree 💕
That's what I mean. Guidance counselors are kind of worthless in the US education system.
As someone that made her first basket recently it is incredibly hard! The skills you get and patience are totally beneficial.
Yeah what was up with that underwater basket weaving thing anyway?
Mine too!
I took classes over the summer to learn how to make Nantucket-style baskets (not underwater, but still...) and it was indeed HARD. Getting everything perfect takes patience and precision. (My baskets are not perfect 🤣.) No "easy elective," that's for sure!
You had an underwater basket weaving elective in highschool? That sounds awesome, I would have signed up for that.
My wife graduated from art school with a major in fibre arts. Basket weaving was the hardest course she took. She was weaving from morning to midnight for weeks.
I agree. This was a common statement back in the day and it never made sense. I never heard of a single school that offered it either.
Not as hard as underwater bb stacking
As a freediver who often struggles to put my fins on in the water, I concur.
It is unbeweavaly hard. :D
I think it would be. But, that's just me 🤷🤣🤣
Why not go back to school and give it a try?
Baskets definitely don’t maintain their integrity in salt water.
That's an elective?? Dude If I had that i would've picked it in a heartbeat that sounds cool
Oh my God
I plan on taking "Woody Plants" class next semester.
Was that a boilerplate script for guidance counselors? Did we all get that chat between 1985 and 1999? I mean? Stamina, dexterity, knowledge of reed properties?
Folks will say the same about an art class until they have to draw a roll of toilet paper.
😆
And yet so fun… what is so wrong with having a learning experience that is also enjoyable?
High school guidance counselors were, for the most part, as USELESS as tits on a boar!
It's as if there were no good reasons to take an easy elective, like you're taking four AP courses at the same time and on the soccer team.
Oh I've got a video for you! 😂 And it's indeed a very hard thing to do youtu.be/yr1E3NUhDio?...
It makes the reeds more pliable. ;)
The one I had suggested the kids who were struggling do "Jam making" in the middle of nowhere in Ireland. I checked and there is no such course. I would have loved to have done that.
A basket weaver talked about this recently on @ologies.bsky.social! In essence, weaving like that is a Native skill passed down through generations and by no means easy, much less underwater. So we really need to retire that phrase.
The oldest known baskets carbon dated to between 10,000 and 12,000 years old. The oldest known examples of Native American basket weaving are found in caves and shelters in the Rocky Mountains of Colorado, Oregon, Nevada, and Utah. These artifacts are believed to be around 8,000 years old.
Right?!
My high school had a class called Tree Identification. To be fair, NH has a lot of trees and non-trees
I had to take four semesters of PE in college. I took Beginner Tennis, Beginner Rollerskating, Beginner Bowling, and Advanced Bowling. ADVANCED! I absolutely would’ve taken Underwater Basket Weaving - bet it’d be a crossover PE/Fine Arts credit.
I bet you they are pretty expensive to buy too. Sounds kind of like a relaxing arts and crafts project though. I wonder if they have something like that on Etsy...
Guidance counselor suggested at 15 I join the army as she felt I had no prospects in the professional world. 55 years later still going hard at it in professional advisory world and never been happier. Mostly they are idiots who cant get a real job themselves IMHO
Seems it’s always classes requiring creativity and skill, such as music composition or watercolor. When my kid’s grade school began issuing actual earned grades in art and music, suddenly parents claimed the hit to their future MD and CPA’s gpa’s “wasn’t fair”.
I never thought of it that way.
I have always understood this to be derisive of those who write about 'underwriting basket weaving', and not those who can actually perform whatever cultural niche thing. Mad respect to weavers, but boo to the critic.
Like when I was an English major and people said "Oh, you're majoring at cocktail party conversation," but I still find cocktail party conversation really hard.
Oh I can help with this! Just talk without pause about cheese. Share random cheese facts until people walk away. It's foolproof.
Try getting a masters in it. … he was right though. I’m unemployed.
OMG I had a high school history/government teacher that said the same thing! LA, California - where were you?
You can tell he dodged the draft.
Have not heard that term for decades. How did it become so well used?
Been hearing about underwater basket weaving since childhood and never was offered the opportunity. Started to think it didn’t exist. Then saw a museum exhibit on Native American underwater basket weaving so apparently it’s real
Ive actually done it. Maybe 4th or 5th grade some tractor trailer “mobile classroom” from the university archeology or history dept rolled up and we all took turns going in it and weaving a wee basket underwater.
If I remember correctly (it’s been like 20 years ago) you like dunk it in the water so its pliable? Maybe put it under water to tuck the end in easier?
Yes! That’s what always makes me laugh about the phrase— you do in fact have to put your reed in water so you can more easily weave your baskets.
Lol
This AI used underwater basket weaving to roast me, and it just made me want to learn how to make baskets 🤣
yeah i think i’d run out of breath and drown before i finish the basket. maybe that’s the point though!
Isn't it easy if you life your face in the water?
I read this as "underwear basket weaving goes really hard" and chuckled a bit.
I spent the last ...six minutes pondering the significance of underwear and basket weaving until I saw this comment. Then I reread the post again and I'm unable to explain to my colleagues why I'm laughing myself silly.
Maybe it was about the ridiculousness of some course content rather than the difficulty.
I passed basket weaving. I failed the underwater portion.
It really does.
I would rather take Calculus as an elective. :) and I did. It was an easy A and the great thing is, I still use it!
Love the insight! Two of my favorite classes were: Waves and Beaches, and Dinosaurs and other Failures. Great 1 credit classes. Learned a lot in both. Perhaps the counselor should have been a teacher. Seems they needed to gain some appreciation.
Someone once wrote of "beetle-counting and button-sorting," and I thought that was a great description of make-work electives.
That’s so interesting that UBW was treated as an easy elective because when I was a child it meant deep esoterica like first you had to learn weaving, then basket weaving THEN take it underwater
Only true cat lover knows.
I made 160 baskets last year. I thought that was a real accomplishment until my friend said yeah, but did you make them underwater? Now I have to start all over again.
Just spray them with a hose. Nobody will be none the wiser.
Bet you aced geometry
'cause it is...😜
I think this would be a great skill to have. We've lost a lot of skills. Like even preserving foods.
In order to weave a basket, you have to soak the material. Underwater may be easier.
Yeah I failed that class
Underwater basket weaving… WAT?!
Haha. I was a high school art teacher. I did teach a fibers class where we wove baskets, but not underwater.
#BatmanProbably would consider this a useful skill in the event of sea level rise.
Give it a try!
Jelly. We were told “underwater left-handed basket weaving.”
I remember hearing that when Joe Namath was asked if his major was basket weaving. He replied oh that’s too hard for me, I’m studying journalism.
Basket weaving period is hard work, especially if you source your own reeds and materials. Why do we feel compelled to demean someone else's craft or hard work?
We were never told it was easy or hard; just that it was a useless skill to have. But I agree, weaving baskets underwater sounds like an overly difficult job to attempt.
Yo diria que puede ser un curso avanzado.
When did underwater basket weaving become the poster child for this kind of complaint, I heard the same thing in highschool
I've always thought that, too, especially since "on dry land basket weaving" is pretty hard!
That actually sounds really hard.
I'd think you'd have to have a pretty solid background in basket weaving on land to even have a shot
Basket weaving alone! Very skillful work to make a good basket
A guy sang Randall Munroe's "Every Major's Terrible" and when he got to the line about "you'll achieve / slightly less than if you learned to Underwater Basket Weave" he ad-libbed "at least then I'd have a basket."
Ha ha ha. I had a father who used that term with my electives and I thought the same thing. It sounds hard as hell. 🤣
👍
My guidance counselor in high school insisted I take the so-called easy electives not just for myself but also my mister and she took A sewing class and I had to do all her projects for her because she couldn't sew.
Who ever described it as "easy"? That was always an example of a skill that you weren't going to use.
Been a long time since I've heard about under water basket weaving...
It depends on how long you can hold your breath.
clivethompson.medium.com/in-defense-o...
I completed my required classes early, so my last semester was almost all electives. College level Driver’s Ed and college level First Aid were probably 2 of the most practical courses I ever took.
HAHAHA
Time well spent 😉
You know… I never could understand this process description when I heard it. I need clarifiers - was the basket underwater when woven? Was the person? Both? Is oxygen provided or do you have to hold your breath? Is chlorine involved or ocean water? Who certifies this? It sounds unsafe. 😹
I think the saying wasn’t “underwater basket weaving” but rather “basket weaving OR underwater fire prevention”
www.jpost.com/archaeology/...
My parents thought I wasted my time studying history, with an emphasis on nations, nationalism, and Eastern European revolutions in college 20 years ago and this has only become more relevant daily
Underwater what
I've always mentally equated underwater basket weaving with sports like extreme underwater ironing.
I totally agree. Underwater basket weaving would hold so many challenges
I think I would have been an excellent underwater basket weaver.
Hard but not very useful.
It would definitely be hard! (Or I'm outing myself as a bad scuba diver and basket weaver...) I've always heard the term in reference to things that are useless - easy or hard. As in, basket weaving isn't a very profitable endeavor, and doing it underwater doesn't make it any better.
That's how I've always heard it used.
A friend of mine actually took underwater basket weaving at Washington U (St Louis) in the early 1980s. It was a student-led class for P.E. credit. Started with Scuba certification, then got to weaving.
Those who claim, don't know Those that know, know Yeah, I know, that's dumb, but true is true
And if a banana duct tape piece of "art" can sell for millions, underwater basket weaving should prove to be even more lucrative. Lol
The actual piece of art was purchased for $120k. The $6.2mil is for the right to reproduce the piece. This is a private investor spending his own money. Why are we allowing the right to foster their personal outrage. I cannot stress this enough: Who cares?
I only care if someone comes at me saying I no longer have the right to duct tape a banana to my own wall. (Not that I ever would!)
🤣👍
Definitely a challenge
If you know you know 😂
It would be a breathtaking experience, for sure.
🤭
Weave baskets underwater; make YouTube videos about it; sell baskets on Etsy. Sounds like a decent business model.
I was going to say. People would buy hand made baskets. If you make them, people will buy them.
And kinda cool - I’d try it 🤷
Impossibly hard. Navy Seal hard
Lol
When I was in high school it was just plain old basket weaving, which to this day still sounds really fun, and I’m disappointed it was not an actual elective.
My mom used it as "even if you have a degree in underwater basket weaving, it opens doors". Although tbh, I think if I got a degree in something she thought was silly she'd still scorn. Smdh
I took a basketweaving class as an adult with my then-teen daughter. I was SO BAD at it that the very nice seniors in class consoled me with "at least your daughter can do it! She will make you baskets." It was so so hard, and my hands bled from 1200 "paper cuts" from the reeds.
Glad you shared how awful it was. I have kicked myself recently for never learning how to weave baskets. I'll stop right now. So, did you daughter weave you baskets?
Okay, so in my first year of junior college, I took a PE class: Progressive Relaxation. I got a C. I got a C in relaxing. I'd probably get a D today.
Oh that’s me in Yoga. I’m happy to contort my body and stretch, but that whole breath & be part always has me squirmier than a toddler after a sugar cookie. I relax by doing not staying.
Yoga, I can manage to quiet my mind, sometimes. If I need to relax I put on a video of a rushing river and just zone out.
FWIW, it was also fun to try, and I giggled a lot. My basket was really crooked though—like 6in shorter on one side. Idk how is was THAT imbalanced. I tried several more, and my best one was a sorta bowl shape that was too round & tipped over. No regrets. Just also no skills :)
This is why we lived in tribes, your daughter could make the baskets and you could tell the stories, we all have our skills 💜
Wait my college advisor used to talk about this same elective as a joke, how wild 😂