I don't want drones and robot dogs, so we can replace human bias with some corporate backdoor coding to enslave us all. I say we just fix the damn police culture and laws so we get something like every halfway decent country that cares about its citizens. Good police is actually possible.
This is adorable.
I'm not talking drones & robot dogs. That's still policing. And not AI, because yeah, f*ck AI. There are very simple community based ways to prevent crime using pre-existing tech. We do not need a police "force".
Okay I was just thrown off by your use of the word tech. Yes, making police accountable and integrated into community would go a long way. I think also though there is a larger cultural change that must precede this unfortunately, even with the right laws or structure
No. No police. Get rid of police. Police bad. Build community stronger. Networks within community. No police. Police cannot be "fixed".
Okay, but I am not concerned with semantics, I want to know practical differences. Rebranding police as community peacekeepers may help, but it can’t be the whole solution and neither can letting anyone do whatever they have the power to do do it. The only solution is reform even if total
There's ALWAYS more than one way to solve a problem. I do find it is interesting you keep pushing this idea that not wanting cops = letting crime just happen/letting people do what they want. That simply is not the case. Crime can be prevented in many different ways through many different approaches
but what do you mean other approaches? I am all for poverty reduction to reduce “crime” a lot of crimes is just the only option left to people given no other, or isnt even wrong just the immoral rules of an immoral society. But plenty of stuff is nothing like that. People getting drunk and starting
Fights isnt a societal failing it’s a fact of real life. Now we can employ all sorts of ways to reduce the likelihood and solve situations without violence but force must be a backstop of last resort for communities or the strong will just by default do whatever they want to the weak
How do you know it’s actually possible? Police reform has been called for and attempted repeatedly since the mid 19th century. And here we are. Why would it work now?
It won't work. Policing was created to terrorize people.
But it doesn’t have to be. We DON’T have to throw up our hands and say nothing can be done. I will not be convinced that crime isnt a thing, and we must deal with it, so we must find ways that dont fail as past solutions have. Call it whatever you will, but it will involve people, and their job
will involve preventing crimes and solving them. It’s not an impossible dream to imagine they won’t brutalize our fellow citizens any more than firemen or grocery clerks or surgeons do.
No cops. Everything else we pretty much agree on. Solving & preventing crime. Just erase cops. Come up with something better. It's not an impossible dream. Just try. Let go of the idea & look at different ways to tackle this issue. Try it! It's amazing where it can take you.
Start by addressing Poverty Inequity Injustice Disfranchisement Alienation Despair Addiction
We have to do those things but none can be the start they all have to be at the same time and so does preventing the sort of crime that is not a social invention or convention but is just obviously bad, and beyond the capability of an invidual to deal with. Police suck I get that. But that does not
Reduce our responsibility to try and keep trying to make an institution capable of ensuring what we agree the laws are are actually carried out. If there isn’t this role, they won’t be. The strongest will do whatever they want, they won’t need to corrupt the police there won’t even be a fig leaf
1) There are countries without the same police problems. And if you think they still do ya just don’t know the half of ours. 2)Policing is actually a very decentralized thing. That makes it much easier to wipe clean and reform, tho harder to snowball change. Either way, thats kinda like saying
“Why do you think better societies are possible? Crime will always exist. Murder for instance is good to address. But how we deal with it is always a choice always a compromise and always a reflection of our wider cultural and societal choices
Murder is always adressed AFTER the fact. By investigators. They do not need to be police. We will never agree on this. You are convinced a society cannot be safe without police. I am not. Crime will happen with or without police. We can learn to address it differently in 21st cent. Preventativly.
So you mean like a community militia? I’m fine with that. But I’m not fine with simply letting anyone with a gun or knife run amok till they’re exhausted slaughtering people to the point unarmed civilians can wheelbarrow them into a cell. Someone has to protect the innocents who cannot. The fact
our police have so disgustingly failed to do this, perverted justice and perverted morality doesn’t mean I will ever agree we can’t do anything. Again I think we are somehow semantically missing each other somehow, not that you don’t feel this way I just do not know what you have in mind surely
I apologize if I didn’t make myself clear. I do think better societies are possible. I see the police as an impediment to a better society. I think they are an unreformable entity. But the money they absorb could be put to much better use. As could the money stolen by white collar criminals.
But do you mean they need to be removed and replaced, or what do you mean? I don’t think people who are there when you call cuz your being murdered are bad idea. I think police as they exist dont deal with a lotta wrongs but a lot of crimes as our society defines them sure. But I don’t understand
the idea of not having to have someone basically prevent folks from doing anything they want to their fellow citizens uncles those citizens have enough power to prevent that. That’s a basic and good thing. Let’s not distort the ideal with the failure of the failure isnt guaranteed
99% of the time you get murdered whether you call the cops or not. My Aunt's mother was murdered AFTER she called the cops. He came back & killed her. For calling the cops. They didn't stop it. One of my college friend's mother was murdered after she filed a restraining order. With the cops. 1/2
I am very sorry about that. That should never have happened and it didn’t have to
By her boyfriend. The cops didn't stop it. My partner's co-worker, her grandma & grandpa were murdered AFTER her bf kidnapped her, r*ped her for a week, and she escaped. The cops let him out for xmas. He broke in to her gp house, hid, killed them all. Why on earth did cops let him go?
Well I will say same as the other person I’m replying to I must sleep it’s 2:47. And I hate saying that when you are telling me these horrible things, at least let me tell you whoever you are I’m sorry they happened and if I come across as not discussing to hear you I do not mean that. What is it
But a colossal tragedy the way things are police and otherwise. I can’t say more than this and know what I’m saying, I am just sorry. I just hope that whatever is best we figure out and do it, I know absolutely things dont have to be this way they can be better. Goodnight
Dude, I love that we are respectfully debating this. Thank you. THIS is how things get better. Goodnight. I wish you pleasant dreams. Maybe we can figure out a better way together. I will leave this. Interesting read. prismreports.org/2022/02/23/p...
Yes they have to be removed and replaced Do yourself a favor and research how police actually spend their time, how much crime they prevent , how much they solve… Going to sleep now
I was about to say the same thing it’s 2:43 here Christ I need to sleep. I just wanted to say finally I have the same disgust for the reality of policing. I want to solve the issues that the idealized version of policing is meant to solve and also the issues the reality of policing which is horrible
create. I genuinely am open to ideas no matter how radical I just need to understand them and I cannot accept stuff that doesn’t seem likely to improve things, which in my poor power to understand is a lot more things than I should. Goodnight stranger
Policing in the USA didn't exist until white slave owners wanted someone to catch & return their "property". Too lazy to do it themselves, they hired men to do it. Eventually convinced others thru fear it was something to protect them. It's not. The rich get protected. Not those of us paying them.