i have been stuck on JD Vance's claremont speech for almost two weeks now because it is structurally identical to roger taney's opinion for the court in dred scott
Replies
Roberts is trying to out-Taney Taney. He’s going to give it his best shot.
jul 21, 2025, 3:32 pm • 1 0 • view
I don't think JV has an original bone in his body.
jul 21, 2025, 2:49 pm • 4 0 • view
Vance is smart enough to have done that on purpose.
jul 21, 2025, 3:02 pm • 4 0 • view
He is a white male supremacist. I don't get what's in it for his wife, who is neither white nor male. Or for her kids
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 5 1 • view
Especially knowing that at any moment she can be sent to the camps and replaced by a slutty little sectional with two strategically placed wisps of organza?
jul 21, 2025, 3:56 pm • 5 0 • view
Did you misspell Thiel?
jul 21, 2025, 2:26 pm • 6 0 • view
He did that on purpose
jul 21, 2025, 2:24 pm • 31 0 • view
Crazy to think that after a year of Vance we'll all be looking at the Trump era as a better time.
jul 21, 2025, 3:23 pm • 13 1 • view
If so, it would be because Trump goofed up worse in plans of evil. Still there's a lot of room to fight for what's right (as opposed to what's mighty righty). Are we indignant every day? That's an EXCELLENT sign. We should pace ourselves in our response to it, to be sure.
jul 21, 2025, 10:21 pm • 0 0 • view
How would originalists explain the Amendment Process set forth in the original constitution? It demonstrates that the Founders anticipated social changes and shifts of morality would require accommodation. And not all Founders owned slaves. John and Abigail Adams spoke against the evils of slavery.
jul 23, 2025, 6:17 pm • 1 0 • view
JD is a douchebag neo-confederate
jul 21, 2025, 3:44 pm • 7 1 • view
One way to interpret what Taney and Vance said is that we should still be living as people did in 1776. Meaning leeches and blood-leering are medical treatments, there is no sterilization or pasteurization, there are no antibiotics. Finally, the best weapon we have is a muzzle loading rifled musket.
jul 22, 2025, 1:14 am • 4 0 • view
🤯
jul 21, 2025, 4:30 pm • 0 0 • view
Whoa plagiarism ? Chief Justice Taney was a terrible justice! He was obviously racist and pro civil war to protect ownership of Black people!
jul 21, 2025, 7:11 pm • 3 0 • view
I usually try to avoid Vance's pronouncements because they have a deleterious effect on my blood pressure, so might never have seen this--thank you! The similarity to Taney is clearly no accident, although I'd bet he didn't think anyone but the erudite faithful would pick up on it.
jul 21, 2025, 8:28 pm • 5 0 • view
I think it says far more about how he sees himself, as a new prophet for recycled antediluvianism. He'd prob prefer we thought of him as an original thinker, owing nothing to long-dead racists, but he's also deluded himself into thinking he's smarter and better educated than the rest of the world.
jul 21, 2025, 8:40 pm • 1 0 • view
Everything these days has a deleterious effect on my blood pressure, not to mention my sanity.
jul 21, 2025, 8:58 pm • 1 0 • view
We need an essay on this.
jul 21, 2025, 2:24 pm • 49 1 • view
Desperately. Please write it
jul 21, 2025, 2:26 pm • 21 0 • view
😳
jul 21, 2025, 10:29 pm • 17 1 • view
Fascism isn't just the a bad idea, but the annihilation of thought itself. Nothing Trump, DeSantos, Abbott, or Vance say is original. The Heritage Foundation writes 400+ page collection of other people's discriminatory policies. Deleting pages is modern book burning.
jul 21, 2025, 2:46 pm • 2 0 • view
Someone had better alert Tim Scott, Byron Donalds, and Clarence Thomas that their citizenship might be at risk.
jul 21, 2025, 5:00 pm • 5 1 • view
I guess they expect to be found beneficiaries of some kind of legacy-based naturalization. If you kissed up to mighty whitey righties sufficiently, you got the brownie points necessary.
jul 21, 2025, 10:31 pm • 0 0 • view
One difference is that Taney acknowledged that the view he was articulating was racist.
jul 21, 2025, 2:39 pm • 203 1 • view
I suppose there’s one thing to be said for the Confederates & their sympathizers in the 19th cen, it’s that they didn’t even pretend that they saw black people as anything other than some sort of subhuman species distinct from the (white) human race. MAGA is pretty open abt racism but not that open.
jul 22, 2025, 4:56 pm • 0 0 • view
JD Vance has done so in everything but flat out saying he is racist.
jul 21, 2025, 2:56 pm • 63 1 • view
What does he think will happen to his own children? What is his justification for other’ism? His wife’s family? He will not be able to insulate all of them.
jul 21, 2025, 3:26 pm • 60 0 • view
I think he's more than willing to enter into the cabal of people who are estranged from their children because they're a bigot.
jul 21, 2025, 6:09 pm • 0 0 • view
Why would he care about them?
jul 21, 2025, 4:15 pm • 27 0 • view
He acts like a devoting and attentive father. 🤷♀️
jul 21, 2025, 5:19 pm • 4 0 • view
If I had a nickel for every "Christian" who pretends to be one, I'd be able to retire comfortably.
jul 21, 2025, 5:24 pm • 39 1 • view
For some, kids are status symbols or brownie points with gawd.
jul 21, 2025, 10:08 pm • 7 0 • view
he ran with a pedophile. his wife is simply a cover, whether or not she knows it.
jul 21, 2025, 5:25 pm • 1 0 • view
We must’ve had very different models of what it means to be devoted, or attentive. I am so sorry for you, that you look at a man like that, a man who clearly cares only about himself, and think that represents anything related to love .
jul 21, 2025, 8:03 pm • 1 0 • view
That was sarcasm. Sorry.
jul 21, 2025, 9:27 pm • 2 0 • view
jul 21, 2025, 10:08 pm • 0 0 • view
Is there a video or transcript of this Vance speech?
jul 21, 2025, 10:45 pm • 0 0 • view
Which is idiotic because there were free Black people in 1776. So, regardless of what Jefferson ‘meant’ or ‘intended’ the words applied to all. Also, I’m tired of living by their standards. 250 years later, we should not be beholden to what those men ‘meant.’ I think they’d agree.
jul 21, 2025, 2:54 pm • 40 1 • view
jul 22, 2025, 1:25 am • 0 0 • view
Hmm . . .
jul 22, 2025, 1:24 am • 0 0 • view
Taney's opinion? 1/4) "In 1857, the Supreme Court ruled in Dred Scott v. Sanford that the enslaved Scott's four year residence in the free North was not sufficient to make him a free man. In his majority opinion, Chief Justice Roger B. Taney cited two main rationales for ruling against Scott;"
jul 21, 2025, 5:53 pm • 1 0 • view
2/4) "first, as an African American, Scott "had no rights which the white man was bound to respect," and was therefore not eligible bring a suit to court. Second, slaves were property, the same as any other, so by prohibiting slavery north of the"
jul 21, 2025, 5:53 pm • 1 0 • view
3/4) "36'30 line, the Missouri Compromise of 1820 violated citizens' constitutional rights against unwarranted seizure of property. Taney's decision effectively made it impossible to prevent the spread of slavery, even in states that had outlawed it decades earlier."
jul 21, 2025, 5:53 pm • 1 0 • view
4/4) "To this day, many legal historians consider the Dred Scott ruling the worst decision ever made by the Supreme Court; it was overturned by the passage of the 13th and 14th amendments to the Constitution in 1865 and 1868, respectively."
jul 21, 2025, 5:53 pm • 4 0 • view
lostmuseum.cuny.edu/archive/exce...
jul 21, 2025, 5:59 pm • 1 0 • view
📌
jul 21, 2025, 3:20 pm • 0 0 • view
Great (deplorable) connection.
jul 21, 2025, 3:44 pm • 1 0 • view
That seems like a wow column
jul 21, 2025, 2:25 pm • 5 0 • view
I've been saying - if they could bring back Taney, they would renominate him.
jul 21, 2025, 11:08 pm • 0 0 • view
As is his brain
jul 21, 2025, 7:22 pm • 0 0 • view
📌
jul 21, 2025, 2:45 pm • 0 0 • view
JD Vance is essentially saying that the 14th Amendment does not exist. When Trump leaves (one way or another), hopefully by then, we will have erased this MAGA stain from our Constitution and our Democracy. If not, JD Vance may be the next Satan incarnate we have to contend with, and he's pure evil.
jul 21, 2025, 3:32 pm • 14 2 • view
Evils are parasites that misuse goodness, so as C. S. Lewis put it, evil can't even succeed in being evil as well as goodness can succeed in being good.
jul 21, 2025, 10:27 pm • 3 0 • view
😱
jul 21, 2025, 3:35 pm • 0 0 • view
Birds of a (racist) feather.
jul 21, 2025, 2:29 pm • 4 0 • view
Yikes.
jul 21, 2025, 2:38 pm • 0 0 • view
Strict constructionism = let’s ignore the plain meaning of the words.
jul 21, 2025, 5:30 pm • 1 0 • view
It’s as if he’s auditioning. Go figure
jul 21, 2025, 2:27 pm • 4 0 • view
Given JD Vance hasn’t had an original thought probably since he was fucking born…This is checks out.
jul 21, 2025, 3:18 pm • 2 0 • view
Indicative of the use of AI on Vance’s part.
jul 21, 2025, 2:59 pm • 2 0 • view
oh. well, thats comforting. 😬 yikes.
jul 21, 2025, 4:01 pm • 0 0 • view
taney even makes the same move re: the declaration of independence that vance does, explicitly rejecting its clear implications!
jul 21, 2025, 2:24 pm • 1,425 92 • view
Are we potentially looking at some sort of reverse Quantum Leap situation here?
jul 21, 2025, 2:27 pm • 1 0 • view
Yikes!
jul 21, 2025, 2:54 pm • 0 0 • view
here's taney, explaining why the declaration could not have possibly been inclusive of black americans.
jul 21, 2025, 2:26 pm • 1,360 159 • view
@katiewritesbks.bsky.social
jul 21, 2025, 3:55 pm • 1 0 • view
God, this fucking passage
jul 21, 2025, 3:40 pm • 25 1 • view
Imagine if, say, some /states/ had interpreted it that way immediately, and we had access to what the writers had to say about that.....
jul 21, 2025, 6:05 pm • 3 0 • view
Naaaaaaaah couldn't be
jul 21, 2025, 6:08 pm • 2 0 • view
Yes
jul 21, 2025, 3:41 pm • 5 0 • view
It makes my blood boil, every time
jul 21, 2025, 3:42 pm • 9 0 • view
Do you think Jefferson intended to include people of African descent, either enslaved or free, in the class entitled to human rights?
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 2 1 • view
Yes, certainly
jul 21, 2025, 3:49 pm • 2 0 • view
By later in his life he might've waffled on the point, but in 1776 I think it's quite clear that he did
jul 21, 2025, 3:49 pm • 1 0 • view
I don’t buy that. Notes was written almost contemporaneously and has some of the worst scientific racism of anything written at the time. I do agree that he could turn on and off his awareness of his hypocrisy, though.
jul 21, 2025, 4:12 pm • 0 0 • view
That dichotomy was extremely common though! Even among the civil war era abolitionists.
jul 21, 2025, 4:14 pm • 1 0 • view
Yes. Unquestionably. Read the original draft of the Declaration of Independence, esp page three, side by side with the introduction. Here’s a transcription www.loc.gov/exhibits/dec...
jul 21, 2025, 5:26 pm • 3 1 • view
Here’s an image of page 3. The word MEN in all caps and italics refers to people captured and abducted in Africa and brought to England’s colonies in America. Match that up with page one, not only passages about “all men are created equal” but about rights. This is Jefferson’s handwriting.
jul 21, 2025, 5:26 pm • 4 1 • view
This is great - the antislavery draft is such an interesting source and the handwriting point is a wonderful one. I still find it very hard to read even the draft generously given what TJ wrote 4-5 years later in Notes.
jul 21, 2025, 10:33 pm • 0 0 • view
But elsewhere in the notes he also had a gradual abolition plan and separate reflections that god would stand with the enslaved in case of a rebellion. It begins: “I tremble when I reflect that god is just…”
jul 22, 2025, 1:16 am • 1 0 • view
Also, the Declaration (not sure if this part is TJ) has a lot of "us" and "our" language in the specific rights/violations. I do not see the antislavery passage as including people of African descent in those first person plurals.
jul 21, 2025, 10:33 pm • 0 0 • view
Yes the dude was 100% a complete hypocrite and fully knew exactly what he was doing
jul 21, 2025, 3:49 pm • 6 0 • view
One of his most charming traits, I think, is that he was completely self-aware about how much of a hypocrite he was
jul 21, 2025, 3:52 pm • 3 0 • view
Oh you see we cant accept that those noble people were hypocrites so obviously Black skinned people are sub human under the law. Some real sound "logic" there 😡
jul 21, 2025, 3:45 pm • 5 0 • view
Those noble people: man we're such a bunch of hypocrites. Oh well, hopefully future generations will do better!
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 2 0 • view
I personally do not find the argument that "the Founders were super-racist therefore we must also be super-racist" to be particularly persuasive.
jul 21, 2025, 3:07 pm • 10 0 • view
So you are saying Taney was an originalist…
jul 21, 2025, 2:29 pm • 0 0 • view
Rejecting the highest ideals of American democracy to embrace and cherish and coddle its darkest failures, what are we even doing
jul 22, 2025, 1:54 am • 10 1 • view
The political context of the Dred Scott decision is remarkably familiar to today: there was a vague feeling progressives had gone too far and the other side needed a "win," so when abolitionists showed up with what should have been a slam-dunk case, the court smacked them down for no good reason.
jul 22, 2025, 1:57 am • 7 2 • view
Is the argument here that the declaration of independence couldn’t have been for Black Americans because that wouldn’t have been well-received at the time?
jul 22, 2025, 12:19 am • 0 0 • view
Also, of the preamble: "don't take it literally."
jul 21, 2025, 3:10 pm • 5 0 • view
"...their conduct would have been utterly inconsistent..." So close to getting it, and still so far. If you worship the Founders as infallible gods, Taney's position must follow.
jul 21, 2025, 10:54 pm • 0 0 • view
JD knows the South lost the Civil War, doesn’t he? He understands that Northerners also fought in the Civil War, and there were more of them, and they were stronger, and they won, right? And the descendants of those Northerners are still here, and we’re extremely pissed off right now, at this redo.
jul 21, 2025, 3:38 pm • 2 0 • view
Notable that he uses the ADL for his definition of “domestic extremists.” Greenblatt and Vance working in concert to marginalize and deport dissenting viewpoints
jul 21, 2025, 3:00 pm • 3 0 • view
Very clear in his mind, for this audience, who "those that fought in the Civil War" were & which side they fought on....
jul 21, 2025, 4:59 pm • 2 0 • view
They are known for stealing speeches, but this is nuts
jul 21, 2025, 3:31 pm • 1 0 • view
I’m struck by how he doesn’t specify people who fought *for* the United States in the civil war. In his mind, Confederate traitors are more American than a naturalised immigrant.
jul 21, 2025, 4:45 pm • 2 0 • view
If it’s not purely creedal, and based on present actions it’s not just being born here, what could it be? Waiting for some more clarity from ol’ JD
jul 21, 2025, 2:44 pm • 3 0 • view
An oath of allegience to Dear Leader, probably.
jul 21, 2025, 2:48 pm • 3 0 • view
Where does he think Dems are saying people should leave the country of they don’t share Dems’ progressive ideals? And how are Dems now allegedly open borders enthusiasts and people who want to exclude others at the same time?
jul 21, 2025, 4:25 pm • 0 0 • view
Lincoln would puke at what has happened to his party. He hated the Know-Nothings.
jul 21, 2025, 3:55 pm • 15 3 • view
Not if your ancestors fought against the Union.
jul 22, 2025, 1:45 am • 0 0 • view
He thinks anyone who fought in the Civil War has a greater claim on being an American even if they only remained an American against their will and were actively trying to leave and killed Americans to do so.
jul 21, 2025, 5:04 pm • 1 0 • view
Besides the point, but JD Vance is a terrible writer.
jul 21, 2025, 3:54 pm • 1 0 • view
And to think he authored a book that appeals to… Appalachians…
jul 21, 2025, 5:33 pm • 1 0 • view
I should probably delete this as it’s stereotyping and patronizing… But that’s sorta JD’s MO, right?
jul 21, 2025, 5:35 pm • 0 0 • view
Blah, blah, blah
jul 21, 2025, 3:29 pm • 1 0 • view
The projection!!!!!!
jul 21, 2025, 4:01 pm • 0 0 • view
Vance is disgusting on a level I didn’t know I could be disgusted at. He is, literally and without exaggeration, rejecting the founding values of America because he is racist.
jul 21, 2025, 4:23 pm • 3 0 • view
Not only that, he is attempting to redefine “American” to include people who do not share those values. It disgusts me in a way I struggle do describe in words.
jul 21, 2025, 4:26 pm • 1 0 • view
I think that the best way to describe it is that it is physically sickening to read his statements here. That’s not an exaggeration, it literally made me nauseous. I had to pause to let my stomach settle while writing this.
jul 21, 2025, 4:29 pm • 1 0 • view
So I guess his wife isn’t American and by extension his kids are only partly American
jul 21, 2025, 2:51 pm • 1 0 • view
There is so much exaggeration, misrepresentation, oversimplification, and 'bias over reason' in these three short paragraphs. It is stunning that our country's leadership spoke these words. Yes, it is possible to still be stunned by these people.
jul 21, 2025, 4:19 pm • 0 0 • view
This bit: "But at the same time, that answer would also reject a lot of people that the ADL would label as domestic extremists. Even those very Americans had their ancestors fight in the Revolutionary War and the Civil War." Comparing domestic extremism to patriot ancestors! wow
jul 21, 2025, 4:23 pm • 0 0 • view
I recently learned have ancestors who fought in the Revolutionary War and some going back to the earliest colonists. It's still garbage nativist framing.
jul 21, 2025, 2:30 pm • 2 0 • view
The "libruls can't define woman" crowd are now the "can't define American" crown?!? Also, fighting for the dissolution side in the Civil War would, imho, never gives you any kind of "stronger claim" to being a USAian.
jul 21, 2025, 3:36 pm • 4 0 • view
The Confederate States raised arms to not be called Americans, made their whole Constitution and Ordinance of Secession and everything! Vance, oddly enough, has just proven to me that America is principles alone, having very little to do with borders or people at all.
jul 21, 2025, 3:54 pm • 1 0 • view
The Confederates who filled the rank and file also weren't duped, they were familiar with the arms of the day and knew precisely the horrifying things they do to people, and still volunteered to get shot to pieces in defense of slavery.
jul 21, 2025, 3:55 pm • 1 0 • view
Thank you for this, Jamelle. THIS is actual news
jul 21, 2025, 2:37 pm • 4 0 • view
It is difficult not to get caught up in the Epstein news with the hope that it will actually have a cost for Trump. But yeah, this is the crux of the matter at hand
jul 21, 2025, 3:08 pm • 4 0 • view
From "1776" are "African slaves" American? John Adams: Yes, they are. They are people, and they are here. If there's any other requirement, I haven't heard it.
jul 21, 2025, 3:16 pm • 3 0 • view
Yup, no room in there for the gradual evolution of a species, even. What was, remains, I guess?🤷🏻♂️ So long as it serves their own interest, of course. Never let that stray from their words, intent, or deeds.✌🏻
jul 21, 2025, 2:33 pm • 2 0 • view
and this broken-brained fool is only 40. so much time to promote so much more racism.
jul 21, 2025, 2:35 pm • 6 0 • view
It's because JD is a POS and also bc he lacks imagination and needs to poach off others to seem quasi-intellectual.
jul 21, 2025, 3:22 pm • 2 0 • view
The only exclusionary Party is the GOP. And THEY have regretted the ratification of all of our founding documents since the Dec of Independence. With this Coup, they are seizing the chance for a total do-over, recreating our Constitution & country in their own deplorable UN-AMERICAN image.
jul 21, 2025, 4:23 pm • 2 0 • view
All described in Project 25 Fascist unitary executive insanity penned by Russ Vought following L Leo’s laborious takeover of a majority in the SCOTUS This plan has been in the works since KKK days & Heritage Foundation Now they’ll all be prosecuted & convicted or impeached & the GOP is dead
jul 21, 2025, 4:43 pm • 0 0 • view
It’s almost plagiarism.
jul 21, 2025, 4:51 pm • 0 0 • view
Really hitting the “fell out of their guard tower” subtext with those Civil War refs.
jul 21, 2025, 2:59 pm • 1 0 • view
"...people that the ADL would label as domestic extremists..." Specifically, JD, which folks are we talking about? And why does a sacrifice by their ancestors win them a free pass for rejecting ideas like equality or democracy?
jul 21, 2025, 10:59 pm • 0 0 • view
To what extent do you think the terrible writing is intentional? It’s easy to hide the ball behind where the editor’s pen would tear apart the obfuscation and poor logic, especially when you would need an entire well of red ink to mark this up. Some people never evolve past submitting BS papers
jul 21, 2025, 3:46 pm • 2 0 • view
Trying to figure out how he juxtaposes his anti-immigrant/anti-POC stance with his Indian immigrant in-laws. Of course, at play is elitism whereby authoritarians/oligarchs preach/fear monger to the masses but see themselves above & therefore do as they please. Elites play by different set of rules.
jul 21, 2025, 5:39 pm • 1 0 • view
So who is a “real American” according to Vance and what does that mean? Are they deserving of more rights?
jul 21, 2025, 2:30 pm • 52 3 • view
jul 21, 2025, 2:47 pm • 64 6 • view
Oh you know
jul 21, 2025, 3:13 pm • 1 0 • view
The definition of a real American is very simple: Whatever includes third-generation German immigrants whose parents have a history of running brothels and illegal immigration
jul 21, 2025, 2:55 pm • 0 0 • view
White people for the most part BUT specifically all jizz slurping members of the right wing Cult of Villainy that worship at the altars of hatred, greed, sadism, and bigotry.
jul 21, 2025, 3:03 pm • 1 0 • view
Wild that he's so open about how use of force to conquer is prioritized over shared values. Seems like he would agree that if the people he's talking about lose a war for this country, their claims are null and void.
jul 21, 2025, 3:39 pm • 1 0 • view
Is this Taney or Vance? "[E]very person...who were at the time of the adoption of the Constitution recognized as citizens in the several States, became also citizens or this new political body; but none other; it was formed by them, and for them and their posterity, but for no one else."
jul 21, 2025, 3:02 pm • 1,001 65 • view
I don’t really accept the premise that we need to re-litigate whether Black and Brown and Asian people are citizens. If, in 2025, they still cannot accept that fact, they need to secede again. Nobody wants them back this time.
jul 21, 2025, 4:44 pm • 3 0 • view
@unroll.skywriter.blue
jul 21, 2025, 4:10 pm • 0 0 • view
Man produces evil as a bee produces honey. Jefferson, Adams, Franklin, Sherman wrote the Constitution and espoused abolitionist ideas. Vance + MAGA will twist it to meet the racist ideals they promote.
jul 22, 2025, 2:15 am • 0 0 • view
The Constitution begins with “We the people, in order to form a more perfect union”. That’s a statement that the Founders foresaw that the Constitution would change and evolve. When we freed people held in slavery, I’d argue that we took a step toward that better union.
jul 22, 2025, 1:02 am • 17 1 • view
It's always astonishing to me that anyone (especially a Republican) keeps on trawling a Dred Scott line about who 'counted' in 1787 that Abraham Lincoln utterly demolished in the Cooper Union speech, and whose demolition countless other scholars have furthered in their work.
jul 21, 2025, 3:14 pm • 43 1 • view
Also, Justice Curtis utterly skewers Taney's ahistorical assertions about who was (or wasn't) an equal citizen at the time of the Constitution's adoption and what that meant for the Declaration in his dissent (starts at "To determine whether any free persons," about 1/4 way down).
jul 21, 2025, 3:49 pm • 14 1 • view
‘and that it would not be just to them nor true in itself to allege that they intended to say that the Creator of all men had endowed the white race, exclusively, with the great natural rights which the Declaration of Independence asserts’
jul 21, 2025, 4:12 pm • 1 0 • view
If the semicolon use is correct it’s not Vance.
jul 21, 2025, 3:05 pm • 227 2 • view
This is one of those times I wish BlueSky had a laughing emoji instead of just a heart, so here it is. 😁
jul 21, 2025, 3:18 pm • 52 0 • view
The laughing and cry laugh emoji are the Bullshit Age swastikas.
jul 21, 2025, 3:21 pm • 17 2 • view
I think that's the frog.
jul 21, 2025, 3:24 pm • 10 0 • view
jul 21, 2025, 4:22 pm • 5 0 • view
That's actually nicer than a REAL Wankpanzer.
jul 21, 2025, 5:21 pm • 4 0 • view
Frog’s kinda niche. Sub in a swastika whenever Musk or MAGA account uses LOL or ROFL emoji and it all makes perfect sense. The “Hitler did it for the lulz” thing, among others.
jul 21, 2025, 3:39 pm • 9 0 • view
nah i'm pretty sure they're not
jul 21, 2025, 7:11 pm • 1 0 • view
Several states, also adoption are tells, much more after that. Vance is more contemporary oral with officious sounding words
jul 22, 2025, 5:21 am • 1 0 • view
Doesn't read like a mediocre undergrad having a late night bullshit session, so I'm going with Taney.
jul 21, 2025, 3:13 pm • 5 0 • view
Sincere question: do you think Vance has the intellectual heft to craft something like this by himself?
jul 21, 2025, 3:16 pm • 2 0 • view
This also applies to women.
jul 21, 2025, 4:02 pm • 13 0 • view
Why do these people try to act like they have zero history as immigrants? I guess it comes with a disregard for the already existing governments of the natives? Any actual reflection on this fundamental question of belonging would surely show quickly how the only answer is seeing America as an idea.
jul 21, 2025, 3:15 pm • 15 0 • view
They assure you, earnestly, that they and/or their ancestors were the *right* kind of immigrants.
jul 21, 2025, 4:26 pm • 1 0 • view
I watched part of the Mehdi Hasan debate and at least one in that particular group insisted that his roots go back so far as to no longer be considered immigrant. I have no idea when he thinks that magic transformation from "moved here" took place but he denied any immigrant heritage. Bizarre.
jul 21, 2025, 5:27 pm • 4 0 • view
An idea whose founding can only exist as a historical process that extends the circle of belonging as a shared agreement to a certain set of values, not ancestry, skin color, sex, etc. Reason is supposed to be what unites us this seems kinda clear in writings by the founders ive read.
jul 21, 2025, 3:15 pm • 7 0 • view
For the record, domestic terrorism is not made somehow better if the terrorist’s treasonous great-grandpaw fought against his own nation to perpetuate the institution of slavery. I don’t know why that needs explaining but apparently it does.
jul 21, 2025, 3:10 pm • 14 0 • view
There’s no way Vance knows how to use the third conditional properly.
jul 21, 2025, 3:49 pm • 4 0 • view
Was there some light plagiarism going on by Vance??
jul 21, 2025, 3:44 pm • 2 0 • view
We know it’s Taney because we don’t hear the soft rustling of upholstery in the background as we’re reading it.
jul 22, 2025, 5:18 am • 42 0 • view
yoooooooo
jul 22, 2025, 5:19 am • 5 0 • view
Language says Taney. Sentiment says both.
jul 21, 2025, 3:05 pm • 19 0 • view
I’m confused. Even if we were to posit Taney’s interpretation—that slaves of African descent were not to be considered American citizens by the framers—they’re all gone now. Seems his interpretation also requires a rejection of birthright citizenship to get where he wants to go...
jul 21, 2025, 4:39 pm • 1 0 • view
i watched that Medhi Hasan vs 20 Nazis video yesterday, and it was really something hearing some of those people voice excactly the same stuff
jul 21, 2025, 3:05 pm • 61 2 • view
Something odd about seeing someone arguing for a theocracy while simultaneously holding themselves up as more American than others. I don't understand how one's brain can hold those thoughts at the same time...
jul 21, 2025, 5:43 pm • 13 1 • view
It begins to make sense when you consider that they have for centuries conflated patriotism with white nationalism. It’s not about conflicting definitions; they just have a completely different definition of America and patriotism.
jul 22, 2025, 6:07 am • 3 0 • view
Ditto to “the law.” When you operate from the premise that, for them, they see “the law” as a tool to maintain their supremacy, it makes sense why they would permit such a lawless man, so long as he is an effective tool in maintaining white supremacy. They have different concepts for the same words.
jul 22, 2025, 6:09 am • 2 0 • view
Similarly, January 6th was lawful, because they see it as a just uprising to preserve Donald Trump and white supremacy. This might be hard to understand if you don’t have familial history with the Jim Crow era, but the law essentially meant “power used to enforce white supremacy.”
jul 22, 2025, 6:12 am • 1 0 • view
I had exactly the same thought. It's like they all got the same memo. Makes you wonder if the jubilee lunatics are crazy randos or representative of the Republican base.
jul 21, 2025, 6:22 pm • 4 0 • view
I think they’re representative, but not getting the same memo. IMO, this is just the contortion they’ve all ended up with given the mental gymnastics. And their biases, which conflate America and the law with white supremacy.
jul 22, 2025, 6:13 am • 0 0 • view
It is very telling that he does not differentiate the sides of the Civil War... good americans in both sides...
jul 21, 2025, 3:17 pm • 9 0 • view
His wife needs to have a chat.
jul 21, 2025, 3:07 pm • 8 0 • view
his wife is doing exactly what millions of BJP-supporting Indians do every day: push for a national ethnic identity that creates second class citizens to be abused as a matter of course
jul 21, 2025, 3:22 pm • 2 0 • view
Fuck her, she’s complicit. She needs to follow him when he jumps down a well.
jul 21, 2025, 3:20 pm • 85 0 • view
Yep. I agree. She is definitely complicit. It’s really hard for people that never navigated the immigration system to understand the nuances. Her parents have lived experience. She knows better. How the heck can she support MAGA is beyond comprehension.
jul 21, 2025, 3:48 pm • 19 0 • view
Same way lots of immigrants support MAGA: they “did it right” and we should punish “those people”. There’s a study I saw recently that found that folks who escaped poverty were more judgmental of those still stuck in it than folks born into comfortable or wealthy lives. Seems like the same vibe!
jul 21, 2025, 4:09 pm • 10 0 • view
it's the classic arrogance of someone who thinks they'll be the exception to the violence because they have access to power
jul 21, 2025, 5:13 pm • 36 0 • view
There’s a ton of this happening all over the nation and many are learning that’s not reliable protection from these cretins.
jul 21, 2025, 5:58 pm • 0 0 • view
This and acceptance of the immigrant messaging to punch down to prove your whiteness or deservedness of white-adjacency.
jul 21, 2025, 5:41 pm • 2 0 • view
Which is precisely why we need to deport her kids
jul 21, 2025, 5:15 pm • 0 0 • view
counterpoint: we stop deporting anyone
jul 21, 2025, 5:15 pm • 19 0 • view
As a mixed race person and father to two even more mixed kids, I’ve never got over JD Vance going on stage and implying his own kids are inherently dishonest for being mixed.
jul 21, 2025, 5:29 pm • 29 3 • view
oh I don't have enough words of contempt for that motherfucker on that basis
jul 21, 2025, 5:39 pm • 35 0 • view
She feels her proximity to power why would she give that up
jul 21, 2025, 3:21 pm • 3 0 • view
His wife enabled and trained him. Her family is super elitist.
jul 21, 2025, 3:22 pm • 2 0 • view
Deport Vances kids
jul 21, 2025, 3:20 pm • 1 0 • view
Women, seeing as they are in fact human, can also be incredibly evil. Weird you would assume otherwise.
jul 21, 2025, 4:53 pm • 1 0 • view
She's also a fascist why would she care
jul 21, 2025, 3:24 pm • 3 0 • view
The only reason I'm 100% sure that's Taney is the use of "in the several States."
jul 21, 2025, 3:05 pm • 22 0 • view
The amount of MAGAs I've had to introduce to Washington's Letter to Catholics, who were among the first groups to be denied full citizenship. Had we set those philosophies in stone this would fully exclude JD Vance's chosen religion and the many adherents who currently align with his philosophies.
jul 21, 2025, 3:23 pm • 15 0 • view
We only know it's Taney because it's linguistically sophicticated whereas Vance writes and speaks at a fourth-grade level.
jul 21, 2025, 4:57 pm • 31 0 • view
still kind of surprised the extent to which his RNC speech invoked blood and soil, *almost* but not quite to the point of explicitly saying the words "blood and soil" www.presidency.ucsb.edu/documents/ad...
jul 21, 2025, 4:40 pm • 215 19 • view
I’m completely stuck on these two speeches also. The explicit rejection of the founding ideas of the country; the willingness to be openly, proudly ethnonationalist; the embrace of an “inherent” hierarchy of Americans; the directness and pure ideological conviction - it’s all just breathtaking.
jul 21, 2025, 11:42 pm • 21 1 • view
In addition to the When the Clock Broke cast of characters, the other more recent figure this pair of talks brings to mind for me is, of course, Spiro Agnew.
jul 21, 2025, 11:44 pm • 7 0 • view
Agnew is the real founder of the modern Republican Party.
jul 22, 2025, 1:17 am • 2 0 • view
The idea that Americaness should be qualified not by subscribing to the Constitutional ideals, but to the permission of the (white) majority is some fucked up jus sanguis form of the social contract.
jul 22, 2025, 6:00 am • 1 0 • view
To me he’s really dangerous in a different way from Trump. 1) he’s not writing for himself 2) awful things come out of his mouth 3) he makes the awfulness sound so confidently folksy & harmless it normalizes the inhumanity in his words. If you’re not really listening you’d nod in agreement.
jul 21, 2025, 5:09 pm • 98 6 • view
the non-charismatic follower of a charlatan can be 10x worse, like Brigham Young
jul 21, 2025, 9:24 pm • 4 0 • view
Sounds like a similar operation as that of David Duke, but even more polished and manufactured into mainstream.
jul 21, 2025, 6:23 pm • 22 0 • view
Totally. Same messaging without all the David Duke baggage wrapped up in a faux “Appalachian” relatable package.
jul 21, 2025, 6:25 pm • 17 2 • view
He seems to be saying that his wife is a second-class citizen because neither of her parents was born here.
jul 21, 2025, 8:05 pm • 5 0 • view
Yes, and, of course, with his benevolent hand, he can grant her and her family the right to call themselves Americans. I posted a few weeks back on Insta about how these people relish the idea of being the arbiters of who does or doesn’t get to be considered human. Pathetic, miserable fucks.
jul 22, 2025, 6:02 am • 2 0 • view
They’re so desperate for any hierarchy that makes them feel latently superior that they grapple on to this twisted system of them possessing the privilege of being native born Americans. They want that to be the legal distinction that places them above others.
jul 22, 2025, 6:05 am • 2 0 • view
That is what he's saying. But with these privileged elite, they always provide special exceptions for their closest loved ones and family members. A sort of "Michael Jordan isn't really black when he's invited to our all white country club event" laminated "honorary white wealth snob" hall pass.
jul 21, 2025, 8:54 pm • 8 0 • view
I had exactly the same reaction as I watched it, and I too am still stunned by it
jul 21, 2025, 9:38 pm • 8 0 • view
National greatness to Vance and his fellow travelers is when you reject the founding of your country. This rejection is of course why the online anti American left see MAGA as potential converts, unified by hatred of the US.
jul 21, 2025, 10:27 pm • 3 0 • view
Fascinating to be married to a South Indian and talking about “your” ancestral lineage 😂 that’s literally all South Indians do. There’s supremacy there too of course.
jul 22, 2025, 10:16 am • 1 0 • view
Vance says that while being married to the daughter of immigrants and working for a son of an immigrant.
jul 21, 2025, 11:38 pm • 4 0 • view
jul 21, 2025, 3:49 pm • 0 0 • view
Vance: "...America as a purely creedal nation,..." That's where Vance is screwing up USA is not a "creedal nation" That is Vance's pickled brain regurgitating some "natural law" garbage.
jul 21, 2025, 3:16 pm • 20 0 • view
The reference to "the Several States" makes me think Taney, since that was a phrase more in use at the time
jul 21, 2025, 3:37 pm • 4 0 • view
Also, regarding the Declaration of Independence, Jefferson pulled a lot from George Mason‘s writing, which we should also contemplate for context. www.archives.gov/founding-doc...
jul 21, 2025, 3:16 pm • 0 0 • view
Agreed. Contextually correct, i.e. free white land-owning males, yet the Preamble does start out “We the people” so I’m wondering Madison, Jay & Hamilton were prescient or if that’s our present interpretation… ‘our posterity’ is us. Discuss.
jul 21, 2025, 3:08 pm • 2 0 • view
Interestingly, the suffrage for elections to state Constitutional Conventions at the founding were much, much broader than for regular election. Still not universal admittedly, but a much greater effort to give meaning to “We the People.” Not conclusive, but an interesting data point.
jul 21, 2025, 3:20 pm • 1 0 • view
@jamellebouie.net Thank you for not getting over the connection between the speeches. I see it, and it is terrifying. It is back to one taking one's status w/ them everywhere, never allowed to break out if needed. I dread a return to the Dred decision Vance clearly relishes. 🔔🔔🔔
jul 21, 2025, 6:21 pm • 2 0 • view
Note also that Vance does absolutely no work in explaining why the actual answer (Americans are those people who are legally citizens) is unsatisfactory or why any person would have a greater claim on this mystery “americanness” based on their family committing treason in the past
jul 21, 2025, 3:22 pm • 3 0 • view
If it means we can throw Trump out, I might be okay with this.
jul 21, 2025, 3:24 pm • 5 0 • view
Same sentiment in both, but "were at the time of the adoption of the Constitution recognized as citizens in the several States" really doesn't go with Vance's "I speak for the hicks [when not saying how much I despise them]" public persona.
jul 21, 2025, 3:19 pm • 1 0 • view
He’s a divisive little shite, isn’t he?
jul 21, 2025, 3:39 pm • 1 0 • view
JD just say "america is for white people" already i got shit to do
jul 21, 2025, 2:31 pm • 94 5 • view
Exactly. He could have summed it up in 14 words.
jul 21, 2025, 3:45 pm • 21 1 • view
100%, wish he'd stop being bitch ass and just admit that is his angle at this point for his daddy Thiel
jul 22, 2025, 1:41 pm • 0 0 • view
Another shipment of straw spotted on its way to Vance at the Vice President's residence.
jul 21, 2025, 4:57 pm • 3 0 • view
I don’t think Vance understands that a hell of a lot of Americans both have ancestors who fought in the Revolutionary War and the Civil War AND are progressives and liberals.
jul 21, 2025, 5:35 pm • 0 0 • view
I was exhausted by the stupidity of the creepy veep's first sentence. It's like teaching a 15yo how to drive a stick shift. "Yeah, baby, way to grind those gears!" ⚙️ 😤
jul 21, 2025, 3:34 pm • 2 0 • view
Holy Strawman, Batman. He's just making up things that no one ever said. Quite a reach. I like how he implies everyone here at the time of the Declaration of Independence was a US citizen (even though the current US government didn't exist until 1790)
jul 21, 2025, 3:44 pm • 0 0 • view
As if progressive liberals and leftists are making plans and building platforms around putting people out of the country. ffs, son, that wet dream belongs to one side only. Ironically, it’s also the side that whines so much because nobody will sleep with them.
jul 21, 2025, 3:59 pm • 2 0 • view
I'm not familiar with the speech, but this passage is very flawed. First, he mischaracterizes the left, which doesn't claim that rightwing extremiss "don't belong". Also, he misuses the term "creedal". More importantly, this doesn't seem to lead to a coherent answer to the question, given that 1/2
jul 21, 2025, 3:36 pm • 1 0 • view
the country has since before the Revolution consisted of refugees/immigrants from dozens of countries/ethnic groups/religious groups/races. We don't need to agonize over the definition of an American; it's those born here & those who take the citizenship oath affirming allegiance to the Constitution
jul 21, 2025, 3:42 pm • 1 0 • view
My ancestors fought for Norwegian independence against Sweden. I do not consider myself a Norwegian by anything other than fractional ancestry; I am an American. But fortunately we have the fundamental law of our nation to tell us who an American is: it's someone who was born here.
jul 21, 2025, 3:06 pm • 4 0 • view
Vance is an aspirationally wealthy White man. He's bought into the (false) notion that wealth deserves power and authority, which along with a (equally false) belief in White Anglo-Saxon superiority shaped American political, public, and social culture. It was wrong then and now.
jul 21, 2025, 2:38 pm • 12 0 • view
Yeah, those Confederate ideals are ideal. Oof.
jul 21, 2025, 4:23 pm • 0 0 • view
My great grandfather joined the Union Army at 17 to fight against slavery, so according to Vance I have a large claim over America. I will use that claim to state that Vance does not represent what he and all the others in the Union Army fought for.
jul 21, 2025, 2:59 pm • 6 0 • view
I will not accept the claim that those whose ancestors fought for the Confederacy are entitle to make the same claim over America.
jul 21, 2025, 2:59 pm • 3 0 • view
these people that "fought in the civil war," what were they fighting for, JD? and who were they fighting? Might have some relevance to their claim on the nation!
jul 21, 2025, 2:32 pm • 39 0 • view
Plus....lots of us had ancestors who fought in the civil war and who've been saying fuck that shit for a couple generations now.
jul 21, 2025, 2:49 pm • 1 0 • view
Goose meme
jul 21, 2025, 3:46 pm • 0 0 • view
jul 21, 2025, 2:44 pm • 15 0 • view
JD Vance can FATWO. Those who fought in the Confederate Army do not have more claim to this country than descendants of the First Nations. As a descendent of Pilgrims, American Rev soldiers, & Union Army officers, I admit white settlers stole land from First Nations & committed genocide of them.
jul 21, 2025, 4:32 pm • 0 0 • view
Note the sleight of hand where a simple reading of the founding creed of the United States, that all men are created equal, then becomes "Progressive Liberalism."
jul 21, 2025, 4:30 pm • 1 0 • view
I always found the people who try to claim because they're ancestors doing something somehow makes them "better" are be complete and total losers. How much of sad pathetic person you have to be that you have to cling to the deeds of the dead to validate yourself.
jul 21, 2025, 2:59 pm • 2 0 • view
“Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness” is an American promise that has no age. Also ageless: The Constitution promises that it shall not deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law. Vance is nothing more than an editorial writer. Park him where he belongs.
jul 21, 2025, 4:05 pm • 1 0 • view
I’ve heard similar things from family in Ohio and Appalachia (Vance and I have a similar background) and I always ask them if they think being American is like waiting in line for an iPhone. “I’ve been here longer!” Uh, you’re still just as American if you were naturalized last week, buddy.
jul 21, 2025, 3:39 pm • 2 0 • view
A little ignorant of the background on this, but where is he getting the notion that what America is constitutes purely an ideal that must by extension apply to the world rather than the people living on its soil under its domain ala the 14th Amendment?
jul 21, 2025, 3:21 pm • 1 0 • view
Like sure, we can't be the world's policeman and/or we'd overextend ourselves bringing actual democracy to other countries versus our bombs, but why is this argument purely framed in such a way as to exclude those rooted in this country by blood and travel?
jul 21, 2025, 3:23 pm • 1 0 • view
Is JD Vance saying in this speech that there are patriotic people that are members of hate groups according to the ADL, who disagree fundamentally with even the foundational documents of the United States that qualify as better Americans than immigrants?
jul 21, 2025, 11:02 pm • 0 0 • view
Reminds me of the argument the Lt Gov of Indiana made about the 3/5 compromise a free months ago. indianacapitalchronicle.com/2025/04/28/a....
jul 21, 2025, 3:17 pm • 2 0 • view
"progressives don't seem to think conservatives belong in this country" is an absolutely insane reading of the last 75 years "Love it or Leave it" has been and will be a thing and it's not my guys holding those signs
jul 21, 2025, 3:12 pm • 15 0 • view
every accusation is a confession. I've never heard someone from the left saying any American should be deported but I've definitely heard Trump say Communists should be
jul 21, 2025, 2:31 pm • 21 0 • view
Obviously, it's not the case that all people believing American principles are, ipso facto, Americans. In his service to sophistry, Vance fails to grasp that all people could improve by embracing the best American values. And, arguably, rejecting Republicans. Both things benefit the people.
jul 21, 2025, 3:16 pm • 3 0 • view
Twisting “logic” for dummies.
jul 21, 2025, 4:24 pm • 0 0 • view
when Vance talks about people whose ancestors fought in the Civil War, does he mean these guys?
jul 21, 2025, 2:49 pm • 41 1 • view
All that purple & pretend logic just to arrive at how much he personally ❤️s the Confederacy
jul 22, 2025, 2:05 am • 0 0 • view
So confederates that fought against America in the civil war are more American than modern day liberal progressives?
jul 21, 2025, 2:31 pm • 34 0 • view
Yes, that is what that grimy little maggot is saying.
jul 21, 2025, 3:08 pm • 11 0 • view
The DOI is not the Constitution. It's a GOP tactic to bring it up as though the DOI is what governs us and established our government. And the Constitution has been amended many times to adapt to the changes in the world. As was intended. We honor the Constitution by enforcing it. That's patriotism.
jul 21, 2025, 3:25 pm • 6 0 • view
JD Vance is a dumb bitch. Because when I say I’m a proud BLACK son of native soil who’s 5x patrilineal grandfather fought in the civil war for the Union and liberated himself and set in motion a new hope of the American dream. He’s like “I meant white folks….. “ Fuck that dumb bitch.
jul 21, 2025, 3:21 pm • 9 0 • view
Usha is an American because she’s regularly fucking a guy from Ohio, basically.
jul 21, 2025, 2:36 pm • 4 0 • view
This is known as a straw man argument. Fascists come from a fundamentally broken place intellectually, so they have to build from lies.
jul 21, 2025, 4:01 pm • 0 0 • view
“Must we admit all of them tomorrow?” Well, yes
jul 21, 2025, 2:42 pm • 3 0 • view
Exactly. "Liberals think brown people should be able to move to America". Well, yeah. Duh. The only slippery slope is white nationalism sliding into oblivion as they become a smaller and smaller minority.
jul 21, 2025, 3:53 pm • 2 0 • view
Dems need to reclaim the flag bc conservatives & Vance are having trouble understanding what being an American means. They're trying to subvert the meaning of freedom & pursuit of happiness to mean for whites only. I'm close to getting a flag sticker for my car. Maybe a few in different colors.
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 5 0 • view
He uses clickbait anger posting as a way of getting people to pay attention. The very inclusion of anything other than their norms, customs & overarching systemic "values" makes others indicative to them of the very oppression they avoid to take accountability for. Mind you, its only indications.
jul 21, 2025, 2:41 pm • 2 0 • view
Does Vance mean to include those who fought on BOTH sides of the Civil War?
jul 21, 2025, 3:12 pm • 1 0 • view
No, he is only including the traitors who fought to leave the US.
jul 21, 2025, 3:55 pm • 1 0 • view
As someone whose ancestors DID fight in the Civil War and the American Revolution, allow me to take this opportunity to tell J.D. Vance to go fuck himself on the jagged edge of that smarmy hypocrisy that betrays everything America aspires to just because he always has been a mediocre weirdo.
jul 21, 2025, 2:43 pm • 33 1 • view
Same here (although I had family on both sides of the Civil War, damn it). Both sides of my family have been here since we were colonies, and I'd much! rather have the immigrants I've met as countrymen than any MAGA I've ever seen.
jul 21, 2025, 3:24 pm • 5 0 • view
As someone whose ancestors fought for the Confederacy, I am descended from people who decidedly wanted NOT to be American. Though, I imagine that JD would consider them just the sort of folks who SHOULD be here. Vance is a despicable man.
jul 21, 2025, 2:49 pm • 18 0 • view
This sounds like the 'soap bubble' argument presented by George Orwell in *1984* It requires each of us to believe in a 'truth' that isn't true, which enables the Vance logic to 'defy gravity'. Once we allow them to decide the laws of nature are theirs to determine, we have lost.
jul 21, 2025, 3:59 pm • 3 0 • view
So many words, JD, for such vapid thinking
jul 21, 2025, 2:59 pm • 1 0 • view
My ancestors fought for the Union in the Civil War (the winning side, remember JD?) as well as WWII (also on the winning side, against fascism). I guarantee all of them would agree with the concept of America as a multiracial democracy over Vance’s vision of a racist White Nationalist dystopia.
jul 22, 2025, 10:49 am • 1 0 • view
@jd-vance-1.bsky.social You should never become a president. You need a history lesson starting with 1492 and 1620. You also need to read congressional history specifically Congressman Charles Sumner.
jul 21, 2025, 3:23 pm • 1 0 • view
I'm real tired of right-wing demagogues (and wannabe demagogues like Vance) insinuating that the left wants to eject or exclude *anyone* from the country. It's pure, raw, unfiltered projection on their part. We're pretty fuckin laissez-faire about what it means to "be an American," actually.
jul 21, 2025, 2:32 pm • 72 2 • view
Speak for yourself, I very much want to eject or exclude the far right from this country.
jul 21, 2025, 3:02 pm • 0 0 • view
There's a fair few of them I'd want to see in prison (or worse), but chasing them out of the country 1. Requires us to keep immigration enforcement around in some form, and 2. Really just serves to make them someone else's problem.
jul 21, 2025, 4:21 pm • 1 0 • view
Like, are you here? Do you want to continue being here? Good enough for me, you're American. I'm real far-left when it comes to immigration, so I guess YMMV. But pretty much every leftist I know is, if not an advocate for full-on open borders, at least violently opposed to denaturalization.
jul 21, 2025, 2:35 pm • 51 1 • view
When I was younger I was a prescriptivist about language and a bit conservative on social issues. I thought that *I* was doing everything correctly because I did well on tests, and everyone else was just wrong when they differed from me. This opinion could not last long. I’m a deeply silly person.
jul 21, 2025, 2:42 pm • 8 0 • view
And I was like “okay well maybe even if I’m ridiculous I come from a family who knew better” and then I found out that I had a great uncle or something who joined the union army during the civil war immediately after immigrating to the US, that’s cool, but uh…
jul 21, 2025, 2:44 pm • 6 0 • view
Said uncle joined the front against the *natives* in the far western state of Nebraska (lmao) and also died in an accident while the unit was setting up a fort there very shortly after enlisting. Turns out my ancestors were kinda goofy too tbh
jul 21, 2025, 2:45 pm • 7 0 • view
My point being, I’m a descriptivist now about pretty much everything. English is the language as it is spoken, not how specific people say it should be written, and the US is the people as they live, not as how specific people delineate it. And that’s beautiful, in both cases.
jul 21, 2025, 2:47 pm • 10 0 • view
I think I’m just very grateful I had the self awareness to figure all this out, because if my great uncle Bill or whatever had better luck in war I could have ended up on a somewhat different political path tbh lmao. But nobody has good luck in war. The good luck would be not being in war.
jul 21, 2025, 2:49 pm • 7 0 • view
That's exactly how i feel. If you're standing inside America and you agree to pay taxes, congrats, you're an American
jul 21, 2025, 5:29 pm • 4 0 • view
I'd argue it's the converse? Taney says they couldn't have meant it to apply universally because then they'd be hypocrites for excluding Black Americans. Vance says we can't use it as a definition of American-ness, because then it would exclude the hypocrites who didn't apply it universally.
jul 21, 2025, 2:55 pm • 14 0 • view
It might be a distinction without a difference, though, and both are obviously specious, repulsive and wrong.
jul 21, 2025, 2:56 pm • 14 0 • view
So basically, he’s slagging his wife, her parents, their children. Or he’s doing a Clarence Thomas. Thinking that since he’s special, generations of terrorism and racism shouldn’t apply to him. He’s only getting millions of dollars because he’s just better than they are.
jul 21, 2025, 3:04 pm • 4 0 • view
Then we need to do something about JD’s wife.
jul 21, 2025, 2:35 pm • 2 0 • view
Just for the record, the oath of naturalization in the U.S. swears allegiance to the Constitution and laws of the U.S., not the Declaration, and agrees to defend them against enemies both foreign AND DOMESTIC.
jul 21, 2025, 3:36 pm • 3 0 • view
Claremont Institute are "natural law" morons "Those principles include the foundational doctrines of natural rights and natural law found in the Declaration of Independence; " The USA issued a "declaration of independence" from "natural law" to establish "rule of law" And natural law ppl are mad
jul 21, 2025, 2:59 pm • 7 0 • view
I’m curious to learn more about Usha’s forebears fighting in the civil war
jul 21, 2025, 3:46 pm • 8 0 • view
An American is someone who either (1) was born in America, or (2) came to America and signed on to be a part of our society (however you want that to work). No one thinks it’s “anyone who agrees with America’s creed”, what an impossibly weak and irrelevant straw man.
jul 22, 2025, 6:26 am • 1 0 • view
I'm a bit struck by this nonsensical straw man argument "the modern left seems dedicated to doing this, to saying, you don’t belong in America unless you agree with progressive liberalism in 2025." No one's saying that.
jul 21, 2025, 2:34 pm • 26 0 • view
It's what they say to fire up their base...to say that the left is saying something they've never said. And keep repeating it so they continue to believe it.
jul 21, 2025, 2:36 pm • 13 0 • view
The lie is necessary propaganda for when they want to start doing to leftists what they're doing to immigrants right now
jul 21, 2025, 4:31 pm • 3 0 • view
*The leftists or anyone they feel like calling a leftist. Will probably include Bill Kristol lol
jul 21, 2025, 4:32 pm • 2 0 • view
It’s true that defining an American by who agrees with the principles of the Declaration of Independence would lead to some weird places. That’s why nobody does that
jul 21, 2025, 3:11 pm • 2 0 • view
Those ancestors fighting for the Confederacy were traitors to the US.
jul 21, 2025, 2:35 pm • 5 0 • view
Crazy how, out of dozens of people who'd told me in one way or another, over the years, that I didn't belong here, none were anywhere close politically to "the modern left".
jul 21, 2025, 5:45 pm • 0 0 • view
Isnt Claremont supposedly full of Straussians? How do they square this with Strauss’s obsession with Lincoln, given this interpretation is explicitly and continually rejected by him.
jul 21, 2025, 2:37 pm • 2 0 • view
Jesus christ, the racial essentialism vibes
jul 21, 2025, 3:39 pm • 1 0 • view
Thank you for putting together these two records. Jurist Dunce fails at a straw man set up. Has anyone said anti-progressive illiberal people 'whose ancestors fought in the Civil War' shouldn't be here??
jul 21, 2025, 3:42 pm • 4 0 • view
And funny--his reference implies that the folks who 'have a hell of a lot more claim 'over' America' are the ancestors--in DNA & in thought--of those who *actually* tried to leave the US because they disagreed w/ progressive liberal ideas.
jul 21, 2025, 3:42 pm • 3 0 • view
And Vance is educated enough to know this. Definitely not an accident.
jul 21, 2025, 2:35 pm • 8 0 • view
The strange dance he does to get from “American as agreeing with a creedal statement, like the Declaration of Independence,” to “you don’t belong in America unless you agree with progressive liberalism in 2025.” Does he KNOW he equated the Declaration with “progressive liberalism?”
jul 21, 2025, 5:31 pm • 0 0 • view
unhinged shit but also worth mentioning that Vance's head speechwriter was an editorial assistant for a couple colleagues in the Times Opinion section
jul 22, 2025, 2:08 pm • 0 0 • view
It's okay to acknowledge that the Founders did not consider people who were not property-owning white males to actually be equal, but the context should be that it was a historic injustice that American principles should not tolerate, not "they were doing it right back then."
jul 21, 2025, 5:16 pm • 0 0 • view
I know this is a petty gripe, but damn his cloying, aw shucks stylings are so grating. You know, "if you think about it."
jul 21, 2025, 4:07 pm • 0 0 • view
Is he trying to spit out that he thinks J6ers are the best Americans?
jul 21, 2025, 3:20 pm • 3 0 • view
That is some scary shit on paper. Also, to me, it shows inherently evil intent and lack of critical thinking skills when a person says things like "What do I mean by that?", which almost always translates to "Let me explain my bigoted ass"
jul 21, 2025, 3:44 pm • 2 0 • view
That last line...like, yes, they have a claim because Lincoln's successor, Andrew Johnson, allowed the South to reintegrate—though only under white leadership. “I believe [Black people] have less capacity for governing than any race on Earth,” Johnson said. But more of a claim? Please fuck off.
jul 21, 2025, 3:36 pm • 7 0 • view
Vance is the person in class that just keeps talking and talking without saying anything relevant or important
jul 21, 2025, 3:12 pm • 12 0 • view
the circumlocution of "fought in the civil war" is always funny to me. on which side, JD? which side were they on?
jul 21, 2025, 2:59 pm • 107 0 • view
Hey, I bet JD does think that folks who fought on one side of the Civil War don’t deserve to call themselves American, but I suspect we disagree on which side.
jul 21, 2025, 3:11 pm • 39 0 • view
I’ve never heard Vance’s strawman that we should deport confederates, but,,, I’m listening.
jul 21, 2025, 3:34 pm • 1 0 • view
The funny thing is, Vance (Bowman) claims to be Scots-Irish descent but apparently Ireland said "No he isn't" or at least Vance's claimed lineage basically vanishes (as it does for many Americans) in the 1800s due to pure lack of record keeping.
jul 21, 2025, 3:27 pm • 4 0 • view
He’s clearly terrified of having mixed ancestry
jul 21, 2025, 3:33 pm • 1 0 • view
The side that he would’ve wanted to win
jul 21, 2025, 3:14 pm • 1 0 • view
Reading through this and genuinely thinking “what the fuck is wrong with him” At what point has anyone said that only those who agree with progressive liberalism belong in America?
jul 21, 2025, 3:10 pm • 15 0 • view
oh I have heard this! many times! from conservatives, "summing up" liberal positions they don't know or understand because they don't actually listen to them - they tune out/in to an internal dialogue about the supposed value system of whoever is speaking the first time they feel the Ick about them
jul 21, 2025, 6:32 pm • 7 1 • view
it's because they, unlike us, associate politics fundamentally with the affirmative goal of expelling the disfavored from populations, which is why they perceive moves toward inclusion as moves toward exclusion. they don't realize that it's possible to not think politics is about that.
jul 21, 2025, 6:33 pm • 12 2 • view
our side makes the reverse "error" a lot of the time when we, for instance, point out that funding cuts will hurt a lot of people - "not hurting people" isn't in scope for them, even though it's fundamental for us, just like deporting people isn't in scope for us but fundamentally is for them
jul 21, 2025, 6:34 pm • 10 3 • view
exactly. so many of the "insults" our side will hurl at Republicans are so funny for all the wrong reasons, it just shows how LITTLE people understand their perspective and just how important it is to TRY if you care at all about combatting them meaningfully.
jul 21, 2025, 6:44 pm • 5 1 • view
constantly my mom will ask questions like "but don't they care about what's right??" and I say "of course, they just already believe they're right, ma". "how can they say they are pro life and not care about kids going hungry?" "because that's supposed to be fixed by prayer and abstinence-only"
jul 21, 2025, 6:44 pm • 8 1 • view
and a big one is, *they have a very different definition* of what a lost cause is ... and a lot of the people that those on the left want to protect are considered lost causes who are truly selfish and bring others down with them. "pray for them, don't enable them" is compassion to them.
jul 21, 2025, 6:44 pm • 6 1 • view
Someone tell JD there's some cookies left on tray in the oval office waiting area
jul 22, 2025, 1:46 pm • 0 0 • view
he is no genius, not the first time he has done this.
jul 21, 2025, 3:02 pm • 1 0 • view
Look, I can't define "American" either, but I know a political puppet of a South African billionaire who wants to replace the American government with a technocracy does not get to decide what it is.
jul 21, 2025, 3:37 pm • 7 0 • view
an amazing form of originialism. "they basically knew it was bad but they kept doing it, so we have no choice but to do the same"
jul 21, 2025, 2:47 pm • 22 0 • view
Look, back then, this simply wasn’t done! So whomst are we to say it should be done now?!
jul 21, 2025, 3:00 pm • 0 0 • view
Many of them also said "hopefully it goes away eventually, somehow..."
jul 21, 2025, 2:49 pm • 4 0 • view
Mannn he really does say “or the conduct of the founders would have been inconsistent” - so close to getting it
jul 21, 2025, 2:58 pm • 4 0 • view
i don't mean to be a dick, but these people could do literally three minutes of research and see how facile their arguments are. but idk, who tf am i. this is from 'encyclopedia dot com' so it's probably arcane knowledge they aren't able to summon with their mortal powers.
jul 21, 2025, 11:45 pm • 0 0 • view
(also, to be clear, I do mean to be a dick.)
jul 21, 2025, 11:46 pm • 0 0 • view
holy shit, and now I'm seeing that I'm arguing with a SCOTUS decision. I suppose there would be egg on my face if I thought SCOTUS was actually an impartial arbiter of justice and not just another arm for the racist political state.
jul 21, 2025, 11:52 pm • 0 0 • view
taney’s argument sucks for a few reasons. first, it’s facially wrong—it ignores how controversial the topic of slavery was as the founding fathers put together these documents. so it’s actually not clear what the intent was.
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 9 0 • view
second, imo, taney fails to interpret the text of the declaration correctly. “all men are created equal”—it doesn’t get any clearer than that!
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 5 1 • view
third, imo, it’s just obviously the wrong decision. it’s bad for society, bad for the litigants, and just overall a really bad judgement because it exacerbates a horrible injustice that it could have otherwise mitigated.
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 3 0 • view
i think the first two points are the most compelling from a traditional legal perspective. but it’s the third point that i personally find compelling. because while many justices pay lip service to formalism, it’s also pretty clear that historically, they will sometimes just do whatever they want.
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 2 0 • view
balancing respect for the law, formal analysis, with a judge’s true mission, justice, requires careful judgment! i think judges should mostly do the former, but the SC gets more latitude on the latter. also shows—and important to remember—stepping outside the law can create injustice just as easily.
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 1 0 • view
There I go, spending my Monday morning getting mad at a guy that died 160 years ago
jul 21, 2025, 2:28 pm • 20 0 • view
Helped me. I’d never read it before. I didn’t realize he was the original Originalist.
jul 21, 2025, 2:29 pm • 9 0 • view
Love to stake my argument on the premise that if it were wrong, such and such people would be morally inconsistent
jul 21, 2025, 2:33 pm • 6 0 • view
JD Couchfucker is the pseudo philosopher of Neo-Nazism. Shitler’s Alfred Rosenberg.
jul 21, 2025, 5:00 pm • 2 1 • view
📌
jul 21, 2025, 5:38 pm • 0 0 • view
Taney: "if the language, as understood in that day, would embrace them [Africans], the conduct of the distinguished men who framed The Declaration of Independence would have been utterly and flagrantly inconsistent with the principles they asserted" He's so close...
jul 21, 2025, 3:26 pm • 1 0 • view
He was *so close* to self-awareness and just decided to sail right past it instead. Wow. 😬
jul 21, 2025, 2:29 pm • 2 0 • view
Gotta love the whole "OBVIOUSLY it was meant my way because otherwise it means the Founders were hypocritical assholes" trap
jul 21, 2025, 10:52 pm • 0 0 • view
he was so close
jul 21, 2025, 6:00 pm • 1 0 • view
This Taney dude should have read some of the British responses to the Declaration, written at the time!!
jul 21, 2025, 2:49 pm • 1 0 • view
Taney = Tautology to the max
jul 21, 2025, 4:15 pm • 0 0 • view
It was already clear that Vance is not capable of independent thought.
jul 21, 2025, 3:40 pm • 1 0 • view
I’m a European history nerd so my go to is always 20s/30s European right, but these guys really are the Antebellum “Positive Good” crowd
jul 21, 2025, 2:25 pm • 7 0 • view
Vance is a "natural law" conservative Natural laws are deity's laws. Deity's laws are superior to man's laws. So people are not allowed to issue a "declaration of independence" from deity's laws "They were attempting to make things equal which the Creator had made unequal." -Cornerstone Speech
jul 21, 2025, 2:32 pm • 0 1 • view
The DOI also says this: ..”when a government becomes destructive of the people’s rights, it is the right and duty the people to alter or abolish it.” Look forward to re-writing Constitution w/o gun rights, banning religion from our legislature!
jul 21, 2025, 4:02 pm • 0 0 • view
I echo the posters urging you to write an essay. I have long suspected that Miller, Vance, et al combed through Hitler's rise to power to develop a blueprint/checklist. I would expect they have done the same with Dred Scott (also Plessy) to frame their racist proposals.
jul 21, 2025, 2:32 pm • 22 1 • view
@jennycohn.bsky.social is a powerhouse resource. bsky.app/profile/jenn...
jul 21, 2025, 10:28 pm • 3 0 • view
A shame he didn’t learn about this at Yale law
jul 21, 2025, 2:33 pm • 8 0 • view
I tried to articulate just this over a week ago! bsky.app/profile/will...
jul 21, 2025, 3:38 pm • 19 4 • view
"There's a reason we, at least on paper, sought not to do that, dawgs."
jul 21, 2025, 10:22 pm • 0 0 • view
And it wasn't about pleasing a few isolated fee-fees. It was about having any hope of a harmonious country coast to coast.
jul 21, 2025, 10:25 pm • 0 0 • view
Now I have to go read it. Drat.
jul 21, 2025, 2:24 pm • 1 0 • view
Now we can share and educate. A good place to have these convos is a doctors' waiting area. My dad and I might start with, "The GOP just voted to cut $8.6million from Medicaid? Other cuts would raise that another 7.7m? Will you need to move?" Eyes dart, questions come, websites shared. Good day!
jul 21, 2025, 2:36 pm • 11 0 • view
Which websites do you recommend in those cases?
jul 21, 2025, 6:19 pm • 0 0 • view
I want tRUmp to stay alive at least through the midterms; JV Dance is more likely to stay focused on destroy whats left of Democracy. At least tRUmp is distracted by his greed and narcissism.
jul 22, 2025, 6:28 am • 2 0 • view
Vance is more dangerous than Trump because there is no age of consent law for sofas.
jul 22, 2025, 6:55 am • 2 0 • view
Honestly, if it just came down to what they did with their dicks I'd be much happier with JV Dance
jul 22, 2025, 7:03 am • 1 0 • view
Certainly. That’s why he’s more dangerous, he doesn’t have the stain of child molestation to limit his ability to destroy the country. Unfortunately it’s about so much more than dick activities.
jul 22, 2025, 7:05 am • 1 0 • view
Taney’s all too clear: the founders couldn’t have been normal, flawed humans, liable to self-interested hypocrisy, who knew slavery was wrong but hoped it would go away someday. Ergo, they must have held his own deeply racist views. Bam, done. Vance’s format may be similar, but his thinking’s mush.
jul 21, 2025, 3:05 pm • 6 1 • view
Vance is likely the real risk with Thiel and Yarvin behind him.
jul 21, 2025, 2:27 pm • 133 4 • view
💯
jul 21, 2025, 2:45 pm • 0 0 • view
Fortunately he has no charisma. Trump's base won’t follow him en masse. Without that base, a lot of Rs will grow spines.
jul 21, 2025, 2:36 pm • 92 0 • view
G. W. Bush
jul 21, 2025, 2:52 pm • 0 0 • view
Say what you will about W but he was charming in a goofy kind of way. Can you imagine him struggling to order a donut like JD did? I can't.
jul 21, 2025, 2:58 pm • 0 0 • view
Exactly. For a certain audience, Trump is very charismatic and is able to bridge the gap between MAGA diehards and right-leaning independents to form a coalition. Without that charisma, MAGA will find that bridge almost impossible to maintain. For MAGA loyalists, everyone pales in comparison.
jul 21, 2025, 3:10 pm • 1 0 • view
"Without that base, a lot of Rs will grow spines." Really not sure about this as it implies these allegedly spineless Repubs are against a lot of what Chump is doing. And I don't think that's the case. Most of them are totally on-board - even if they wish that Orange Hitler was a bit less uncouth.
jul 21, 2025, 4:06 pm • 1 0 • view
Fair enough
jul 21, 2025, 4:07 pm • 1 0 • view
Which doesn't negate the point that the base MAGAt cult members may be disinclined to follow Vance the way they do Chump. So the dynamics will be interesting, to say the least.
jul 21, 2025, 4:10 pm • 2 0 • view
A lot? I bet like 5... maybe.
jul 21, 2025, 5:35 pm • 0 0 • view
Don Jr will have the genetics, and since that's all they really believe in, he'll be enough for 2029.
jul 21, 2025, 3:03 pm • 0 0 • view
I don't know enough about him beyond Vance was his idea, and Vance is apparently screwing Trump over. The base won't like that.
jul 21, 2025, 3:07 pm • 0 0 • view
OK, so it’s not Obama‘s fault for making fun of the FOTSUS. It’s John Miller, the producer for the Apprentice‘s fault. This is all celebrity, and racism, glaze. Vance has none of that. Along with trashing our economy, our global security, our health for the first felon to take as much as he can.
jul 21, 2025, 3:07 pm • 0 0 • view
Trump is a front man. 🤷🏼♀️
jul 21, 2025, 3:10 pm • 1 0 • view
Trump is the grifter for himself. Others think they’re using him for their ends. But he will take everything he can in sight and then turn on whoever supported him. Look at musk, look at Murdoch.
jul 22, 2025, 7:40 am • 0 0 • view
I think you’re right. Trump is a teenager that has never stayed in a hotel and is going to steal everything that is not nailed down. Thiel’s government funded observation state and Yarvin’s dark enlightenment ideas threaten to fundamentally dismantle the US and the world as we know it.
jul 22, 2025, 10:36 am • 1 0 • view
I have 20 something kids. I am my mama bear. I will do everything possible. I am supporting.
jul 26, 2025, 10:59 am • 0 0 • view
Indeed. I can't see the Trump sycophants sticking their heads up Vance's ass and MAGA is not going to take to Thiel. I think that it will be MAGA v. The Heritage Foundation when Trump leaves office (however that may be).
jul 21, 2025, 2:39 pm • 54 1 • view
Every time I see Thiel speak I think of Armitage finally crashing out in the William Gibson novel, Neuromancer
jul 21, 2025, 3:14 pm • 3 0 • view
Exactly. Vance is an object of ridicule. So was Trump, but the ridicule didn’t stick.
jul 21, 2025, 2:40 pm • 16 0 • view
Trump had historically demonstrated his ability to endure any and all embarrassment and humiliation without it tempering his absurd and pathological stubbornness. Vance has demonstrated he can write a shitty novel and fuck a couch.
jul 21, 2025, 5:03 pm • 1 0 • view
Unfortunately they'll have instituttional momentum to keep them going once the jester kicks it. That doesn't last forever, but long enough to cause a hell of a lot of carnage.
jul 21, 2025, 4:10 pm • 0 0 • view
You underestimate the power of the propaganda machine.
jul 21, 2025, 2:56 pm • 0 0 • view
Remember, Vance is a couch fucker. It'll be an uphill battle.
jul 21, 2025, 2:58 pm • 0 0 • view
Geste-I agree with your assessment. Vance doesn’t have traction.
jul 21, 2025, 3:57 pm • 2 0 • view
Trump's whole thing is leading a cult of personality, it will translate to no one when he dies. And his heart issues aren't going away.
jul 21, 2025, 2:58 pm • 2 0 • view
The entire line of succession is disturbing and problematic.
jul 22, 2025, 3:17 am • 4 0 • view
Yep. Nehemiah Scudder's just the foot in the door.
jul 21, 2025, 3:56 pm • 0 0 • view
Haha no. Vance can't hold the coalition between techbros and white nationalists together. Trump can barely do that, and people like him.
jul 21, 2025, 3:07 pm • 1 0 • view
The end of Trump is coming, either from politics or his own body, so it's a question we're all going to deal with.
jul 21, 2025, 2:57 pm • 1 0 • view
I find fear of Vance to be overrated. If he became Pres (either due to Epstein fallout or Trump's health), he wouldn't have the same hold over the Rs and MAGA base as Trump. It's a cult, they worship the leader. Vance has negative charisma and you need to only look at his '22 Senate race.
jul 21, 2025, 2:57 pm • 4 0 • view
The ideology is a major threat, but the guy himself has the political acumen of a telemarketer. He would never be able to lead a movement like this even among people who agree with him.
jul 21, 2025, 3:23 pm • 1 0 • view
☹️
jul 21, 2025, 2:22 pm • 0 0 • view
Reincarnation?
jul 21, 2025, 2:33 pm • 0 0 • view
😳
jul 22, 2025, 1:21 am • 0 0 • view
Coincidence? I think not.
jul 21, 2025, 2:39 pm • 1 0 • view
This is an exceptionally insightful and deeply disturbing observation. Add this to all the other white nationalist, fascist, and neo-nazi statements and actions by this administration and it feels like our country is sliding into the dark ages.
jul 21, 2025, 3:16 pm • 7 1 • view
With a lot of hands doing the pushing down that slide.
jul 21, 2025, 4:06 pm • 1 0 • view
Vance has brown fucking kids and a brown wife. I do not understand JD Vance.
jul 21, 2025, 2:29 pm • 28 4 • view
_First_ wife. In the GOP, Vance has the option of trading her for a younger, whiter model.
jul 21, 2025, 2:58 pm • 1 0 • view
see, e.g., Thomas Jefferson
jul 21, 2025, 6:30 pm • 0 0 • view
Half-Asian kids are pretty frequently white-passing (all my half-Indian cousins are, for example) and he doesn’t think women are people. He also prefers that his wife and children owe their citizenship to him than that they are entitled to it in their own right.
jul 21, 2025, 2:35 pm • 21 2 • view
All my half-Indian nephews and nieces on the other hand are undeniably of Indian heritage. Everyone is different. But JD Vance is a garbage person.
jul 21, 2025, 2:53 pm • 10 0 • view
Dominance.
jul 21, 2025, 4:10 pm • 0 0 • view
Doesn’t his logic apply to white women also?
jul 21, 2025, 4:48 pm • 0 0 • view
‘Consistency’ is a minor detail to those who think they are THIS CLOSE to becoming unaccountable dictators (or at least aristocracy in a permanent majority)
jul 21, 2025, 2:33 pm • 5 0 • view
Wow! Good catch.
jul 21, 2025, 4:16 pm • 0 0 • view
with all this insistence on making it the 1850s again I hope we can respond nationally with some of the activities of the 1860s
jul 21, 2025, 2:25 pm • 4 0 • view
Minus the events of, say, December 26th, 1862 (Mankato, Minnesota) and most of 1863. I suspect if we had a bounty on scalps now people wouldn't hesitate.
jul 21, 2025, 3:49 pm • 3 0 • view
You think he asked the chatbot to get him the argument he wanted and it put Taney in modern colloquial tone?
jul 21, 2025, 4:01 pm • 1 0 • view
Somebody needs to ask JD if he thinks his wife and children have a claim to American-ness under his rubric since the founders would've been aghast at him marrying a brown-skinned South Asian Hindu and fathering mixed race children with her.
jul 21, 2025, 4:11 pm • 11 0 • view
Colbert might have asked him...no one else
jul 21, 2025, 5:39 pm • 0 0 • view
Colbert still has several months to go. Let's see what he comes up with.
jul 21, 2025, 10:23 pm • 2 0 • view
Did he even write it himself or was it ghost written?
jul 21, 2025, 10:06 pm • 0 0 • view
If he plagiarized it, maybe we can get the NYT and Rufo on the case
jul 21, 2025, 3:47 pm • 3 0 • view
Just confirmed you are smarter than I am.
jul 21, 2025, 7:23 pm • 0 0 • view
I believe the message is clear.
jul 21, 2025, 2:23 pm • 1 0 • view
Yes. Both Taney and Vance dress authoritarianism in legal costume. Dred Scott denied Black citizenship to preserve a violent order. Vance’s Claremont speech does the same for a lawless presidency. Chilling. Deeply disturbing. And a warning shot (opinion was in 1857, just before Civil War.)
jul 21, 2025, 3:57 pm • 65 13 • view
The Trump team is clearly focused on the worst side of humanity and eventual history will reveal how evil this was. Does the whole ewe essay get to be turned into a private club for these pettifoggers?
jul 21, 2025, 10:12 pm • 3 0 • view
@jamellebouie.net, I beg you on behalf of your adhd/neurodivergent followers to use capital letters so we don’t have to struggle to intake your excellent and irreplaceable content!
jul 21, 2025, 3:12 pm • 1 0 • view
#CurtusYarvin. I'm all for Trumpkkkin paying the piper for decades of cheesebuders but JD will be no cake walk.
jul 21, 2025, 5:17 pm • 2 0 • view
Sounds like much of the legal reasoning of the Roberts Court too.
jul 21, 2025, 2:25 pm • 10 0 • view
I view Vance as more in the Alexander Stephens mold philosophically. So interesting* he's borrowing from Taney rhetorically. (*not at all interesting or surprising)
jul 21, 2025, 2:58 pm • 0 0 • view
It’s pretty horrifying. I have stopped myself from re-quoting it on more than one occasion because it is that heinous of an opinion, an ideology’s vulgar and bigoted hate made clear as day.
jul 21, 2025, 2:25 pm • 45 0 • view
If it's actually germane, do it, with appropriate observations of shock and horror, of course. And I take it your moniker is a bit of an ironic jest -- I wouldn't suggest to anyone to think this earthly life can actually be a utopia. But it can be improved as a witness of God's benevolence.
jul 21, 2025, 10:19 pm • 0 0 • view
That speech is honestly the most alarming thing any leading US pol has said in my memory, and I am including every nutty thing POTUS has said. A person who isn't a nut saying that stuff is deeply, deeply disturbing.
jul 21, 2025, 2:46 pm • 2 1 • view
Keep an eye on Vance. If/when Trump cools it, JD is Peter Thiel's sock puppet. Things could get a LOT worse quickly without pushback.
jul 21, 2025, 5:24 pm • 4 0 • view
This is a compelling argument. If Jefferson were alive today, how would he view this desecration of the Declaration? I'm probably leading there, but it seems obvious he would be stunned by the last seven years in America.
jul 21, 2025, 4:20 pm • 3 0 • view
My question: Why would any decent person want to make these arguments, either Taney's or Vance's? Their arguments are both facially wrong and morally abhorrent.
jul 21, 2025, 7:13 pm • 1 0 • view
Because they appeal to facially wrong and morally abhorrent souls. A system of law can not be put to better use than the state of the souls that undertake to live by means of it.
jul 21, 2025, 10:28 pm • 0 0 • view
Well, and obviously not decent people. I concur, simply from a different angle.
jul 21, 2025, 10:29 pm • 1 0 • view
It's an astute comparison. They are from the same slice of America that has existed since the start. The slice obsessed with defining the country as only for themselves. They put intellectual dressing on America's hateful id
jul 21, 2025, 3:26 pm • 3 1 • view
Vance is setting up and then knocking down a straw man: that everyone who agrees with America’s founding principles is an American. But he made that up so he could point out its weaknesses! It’s not how American-ness works! The Constitution lays out who is an American.
jul 21, 2025, 2:58 pm • 1 0 • view
All the Constitution says is that “The Congress shall have Power…to establish a uniform Rule of Naturalization.” It also does not specifically mention any Federal power over non-citizen immigrants, as pointed out in debates over the Alien & Sedition Acts.
jul 21, 2025, 3:57 pm • 1 0 • view
Not a lawyer let alone a con law lawyer. It’s the 14th Amendment. My original point — which is that Vance is making stuff up that might sound good but is nonetheless utter BS — stands
jul 21, 2025, 4:35 pm • 4 0 • view
True! “All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.”
jul 21, 2025, 4:39 pm • 3 0 • view
A Yale graduate making that idiotic straw man argument is an evil man who thinks the populace is stupid.
jul 21, 2025, 3:53 pm • 0 0 • view
Return of america's Golden Age
jul 22, 2025, 4:43 am • 0 0 • view
Where is the couch in all this? Is it feeling neglected?
jul 22, 2025, 1:22 am • 0 0 • view
The Roberts' court is looking like the worst one ever. It's like the MAGA Congress, which is to say unwilling to put aside its partisan goals for its Constitutional duties. Checks and balances are alien ideas to these MAGA Fascists.
jul 21, 2025, 5:07 pm • 13 0 • view
Did you expect real work? Authenticity? 😶 That's not what Trump regime is known for.
jul 21, 2025, 8:42 pm • 0 0 • view
Serious question then, are JD kids considered "fully American" with all the same inherent rights and privileges as Nancy Pelosi's kids? How about Trump's kids from immigrant Ivana and Melania? Does this position mean Tiffany is the only true American heir of Donald?
jul 21, 2025, 3:26 pm • 3 0 • view
Our nation was founded on an ambitious set of ideals. Do we strive to make those ideals reality? Or Do we use the fact that the founders didn't live up to their ideals as justification for us not living up to them either? That has been the philosophical battle since our founding.
jul 21, 2025, 2:54 pm • 4 0 • view
Yes, he is going to be a much more malignant president than Trump.
jul 21, 2025, 2:46 pm • 2 0 • view
Since we're living our own version of the 1850s, an apt comparison. Complete with conservatives who blather about states rights but destroy them when convenient - just like 1850s southerners who passed a federal Fugitive Slave Act to force unwilling northern states to repatriate escaped slaves
jul 21, 2025, 2:27 pm • 85 8 • view
Exactement!
jul 21, 2025, 4:07 pm • 1 0 • view
When i read about the bounty bill to allow private actors to pursue anyone who helped facilitate an abortion for Texans, even out of state, I called it the “Fugitive Uterus Act”. Same dynamic, same reasons. The most restrictive state gets to define policy for all.
jul 21, 2025, 2:31 pm • 98 6 • view
What if #BlueStates had a bounty on the bounty bill allowing private assholes to pursue anyone who is pursuing someone in their state based on a TX law that state does not recognize?
jul 21, 2025, 5:00 pm • 1 0 • view
Yes, and women in the south need an Underground Railroad.
jul 21, 2025, 2:32 pm • 35 0 • view
We shouldn’t need mutual aid networks to get women to places in the United States where they are full citizens, but here we are.
jul 21, 2025, 2:33 pm • 46 3 • view
It is a bridge built in the context of battle, and outlines a philosophy that we should be undertaking even in peacetime.
jul 21, 2025, 10:14 pm • 0 0 • view
I.e. that the society as a whole should be mutual aid minded, whether through philanthropy or through government mediated benefits programs.
jul 21, 2025, 10:16 pm • 0 0 • view
But aid doesn't entail egging on stinkers.
jul 21, 2025, 10:16 pm • 0 0 • view
bsky.app/profile/did:...
jul 21, 2025, 2:34 pm • 39 3 • view
Does make me wonder how many people are trying for 'the clarity and focus of fascism but without the racism'. Authoritarians gonna authoritarian, no matter the label.
jul 21, 2025, 3:53 pm • 0 0 • view
They've been awfully quiet lately...
jul 21, 2025, 2:37 pm • 11 0 • view
A decade ago, when on social media I broached the subject of the absolute debacle that would result from a Trump election because of Democrats refusing to support Hillary, I was told "you're harshing my mellow". Seriously.
jul 21, 2025, 2:42 pm • 18 0 • view
Me too. I'd warn folk back in the day when the danger was that Trump would get to appoint ONE judge on SCOTUS. By "punishing" the Dems they handed the power over to totalitarian fascists. They certainly won't see the damage remedied during their lifetimes.
jul 21, 2025, 3:17 pm • 15 1 • view
So he’s a plagiarist in addition to being a worthless waste of bad faith skin.
jul 21, 2025, 7:51 pm • 1 0 • view
Helpful insights and receipts for those of us not schooled in constitutional Law. Grateful.
jul 21, 2025, 4:58 pm • 0 0 • view
The people who Vance supports would enslave his wife and children in a matter of seconds.
jul 21, 2025, 2:40 pm • 7 2 • view
When they tell you who they are, believe them.
jul 21, 2025, 2:23 pm • 15 1 • view
📌
jul 21, 2025, 10:53 pm • 0 0 • view
The only voíce I want to hear less than Trump’s is Vance’s.
jul 22, 2025, 2:18 am • 1 0 • view
@jamellebouie.net Why has Vance flown under the radar? He explicitly is saying most of the nation are not "real" Americans. Democrats can't denounce and make hay out of that?
jul 21, 2025, 11:29 pm • 11 0 • view
The media orgs don't take Vance seriously, and neither does anyone else. He's considered a joke, an errand boy with no actual power or influence. That was demonstrated in the Yemen group chat on Signal, when Waltz called in Miller to overrule Vance WRT bombing Yemen.
jul 22, 2025, 12:48 am • 3 1 • view
I wonder if Vance doesn’t take Vance seriously. He morphs from one form to another, one set of values to another as if he doesn’t respect our recognize his true core self. He seems lost in a play, an actor pretending to be someone. Today he is Simon Legree. Yesterday, Roger Taney SCOTUS bigot reborn
jul 22, 2025, 6:11 am • 3 0 • view
They should take him seriously. He is a heartbeat away from the presidency. He is dangerous.
jul 22, 2025, 1:02 am • 10 1 • view
📌
jul 21, 2025, 6:18 pm • 0 0 • view
He is such a horrible person.
jul 21, 2025, 4:45 pm • 1 0 • view
📌
jul 21, 2025, 4:04 pm • 0 0 • view
Old dogma is resurrected and put to the original use - emotional appeals to blood and soul
jul 21, 2025, 10:57 pm • 5 0 • view
Thank you for having the wherewithal to revisit it. I could barely force myself to read it the first time. Also everyone is throwing around the ADL as if all Jewish Americans view it as representing their voices. It doesn’t represent mine.
jul 21, 2025, 3:33 pm • 1 0 • view