The 2 most rabidly toxic groups demanding purity on this app seem to be the "never-Kamala leftists" and the "stand by the DNC no matter what" folks. The former calls me a "lib" if they don't like what I say...the latter a "commie". Both have called me a bitch.
Thats not fair to you. Don't know who's actually on those lists, but one thing we all need to do is not shy away from holding both sides of the political isle accountable for not doing what they should be doing. Dems are not perfect either, but we can't allow fascism to take root in America either.
F*ck em. I blocked them. Don't waste your good energy on trash.
I blocked about a dozen accts today. Felt awesome.
There is a MAGA list that blocks MAGA accounts that has stopped %100 of harassing MAGA trolls & bots for me since I started my account here in Nov 2024. It will save you from a massive mountain of MAGA trouble makers when you post on the platform Click on the dots bsky.app/profile/did:...
Best to make your own list. If you use someone else's list, don't go further than using it as a mutelist
Thank you for posting the list! I've been proactively blocking them since joining the platform. I refuse to subject myself any further to their stupid sh*t lies and tropes.
You are welcome. I left X-hellscape the day after the election I had a 15 year acct on Twitter with never a problem until 2016 It's a cesspool of hell of their own making I created 1 list when I 1st started and that's it. I don't promote me because I'm just a single human being trying to be human.😊
And during Mercury Retrograde is the perfect time to do it!
worst of all - your a centrist...a white female centrist in America.
I'm not a centrist. Not in American politics and not on the global spectrum.
You're a fence sitter among fence sitters. Even worse.
Please identify the f'ing fascists, these "never-Kamala leftists" disguised as being on the moral side of history. I'm sure many of us are more than ready to pound false-flaggers into the ground, both word-wise and elsewise when given the opening.
I had my communist card revoked bc I shared on here that I’m a communist who voted for Harris lol. I understand where both are coming from. At first I felt opposed to non-blue state ppl who didn’t vote for Harris and called them useful idiots. I don’t really feel that way anymore.
There‘s value in refusing to vote for ppl with harmful politics to force our country left. When they keep getting voted in, they don’t feel the need to change. We can protest but their power isn’t threatened Establishment dems don’t have a winning platform. *They* are responsible for their failure
Establishment dems are a threat because people tend to become complacent when they are in charge. We urgently need radical change. Liberals don’t understand this but how can anyone blame someone for being scared and voting to prevent Trump? We need them. So many leftists lack nuance.
hmm wonder why
Fuck off
Fuck them 🖕🏻
I resonate so much. There was a post mindlessly praising Kamala as the rejected messiah. I made a comment critical of her, though I qualified that I’d voted for her. So many responses called me a liar! Nuance either gets you called a lying traitorous underminer or a heartless genocide supporter
Yup, said she was probably the worst candidate the DNC could have belatedly fielded for what was clearly a democracy-saving election, but I voted for her anyway because there literally was no other choice...and got piled on by various purists. It's ridiculous. Nuance/gray is not tolerated even here.
Too many people believe surface level morals cannot ever be compromised, even temporarily for a political victory. I blame Hasan Abi for this one. He was still malding about it even in his contrapoints callout video, which was stupidly and unnecessary. Natalie was right.
Non participation is still a choice. I didn't vote and I get stuck with dump just like you though but if enough people stopped participating they would be more motivated to act in ways that effect change is the way I see it
Not in this case. Non participation got us fascism.
Blue fascists are more your aesthetic am I right ?
No, you are not. The cruelty and destruction promised by Krasnov and his 900 page written plan was far, far more dangerous than the corrupt but hapless DNC. We can fix the blue side and will. The other needs to be destroyed, not allowed to flourish through abdication of civic responsiblity.
All of your solutions end with eugenics am I right ?
I agree that democrats are fascist just in a subtler, more gradual way. But I disagree that that difference is irrelevant. And anyway, I’m pretty sure they meant “destroy” in an ideological sense not literal “kill every republican” kinda way
Again, nuance is lost on the purists. And yes, destroy as in the party and propaganda machine the GOP has built over the last 40 years. But apparently the GOP's war on brown people and push for more white babies is ok as long as they could "vote their conscience" and feel good about themselves.
Your messiah doesn't codify anything so it can be more easily rolled back but sure I guess that makes me a purist.
Democrats are not fascist in any way, shape, or form. Fascism is a specific form of one-party dictatorship. Not everything people don't like or want.
The duopoly Dems and the GOP have in the US has led to a functional uni-party in the last 30 decades. Yes Republicans are more overtly fascistic, but Democrats have helped enable and maintain the police state, the surveillance state, the military industrial complex, unprecedented wealth inequality
Why not vote Green instead of not voting at all? I really am curious about why that decision in particular.
Because to meet its really only a couple and barely even that. It's the same corporate donors who set the rules of the game. It only works until we are hungry enough to smash the board into pieces that the game is finally over.
You realize that smashing the board will costs many deaths and much suffering, regardless of how noble it is to end the game, right?
I'm not after honor only survival
Who’s survival? Because plenty of pawns rely on the system to live, as fucked up as it is. When supply chains collapse or currencies are dissolved, what happens?
Anyone who came. Shit really is really fucked up
You mean survival for yourself, not for disabled people, desperate people, or unlucky people. Wait, no, your plan ALSO calls for your own survival to be imperiled. So you're not actually after honor OR survival, you're after half-assed social media dunks.
Or I suppose we could die waiting for the perfect plan that isn't coming. Nobody's coming to save us. We have to do it ourselves.
Let's be clear: a revolution would be a nightmare that would not achieve anything you want. But it's a moot point, because your plan is to start a mass populist movement... that nobody's allowed to join unless they listen to all the same podcasts as you. You're not good at math.
well you did vote for genocide
Just as there’s no ethical consumption under capitalism, there’s no ethical politics under imperialism. You do your best. If you had a line at genocide, I commend you. But don’t judge me for having cared about all the vulnerable people in the US & abroad who’ve been fucked over bc Trump’s in power
You can’t say “Trump is dangerous” while voting for most - not all, but most - of Trump’s platform because Democrats support it too.
They’re so delusional. They really thought they could not only flip the Dems on Israel, but also the general public, in like a month before the election? Dems SIGNALED, MULTIPLE TIMES that they were willing to move on the issue. And they still didn’t vote Kamala.
Signaled multiple times by what? By saying they'd "change nothing"? Also, October 7th, 2023 was a year before the election, not a month. And that's not counting us leftists they have been against this genocide for much longer.
I honestly blame Hasan Abi for this one, for pushing this delusion that the general public would change its staunchly pro-Israel, pro-Zionist stance in A MONTH. In his contrapoints callout vid, he even brought it up again. He’s coping so hard rn.
It really wasn’t about changing the mind of the entire population. It was about keeping enough people that voted for Biden but got tossed under the bus by Biden’s policies on the issue onboard with Harris.
if one twitch streamer can somehow determine the outcome of your democracy that democracy is utter bunk
i absolutely love the idea Hasan could have that kind of sway
Half his viewers can't vote lol shitlibs love defending the dems for doing dumb shit that lost them votes and blaming the people the campaign proudly pushed out, and either scolded or ignored. When the campaign says they don't want your vote some people listen.
He’s still coping about it.
At best. More likely he's planning how to lose the next one
buddy I don't think it's him that's coping
A not insignificant amount of influence. I hear his rhetoric from harpies like you all the time.
and by "rhetoric" you mean things like not killing Palestinian children right?
do you think that all leftists are assigned opinions by one twitch streamer
Cope
dude can you read what you're typing before you vomit it out
Cope
I blame Kamala Harris for allying w/ Republicans & the Cheneys, ignoring trans people & Palestinians, for failing to run a successful campaign against Trump etc. I blame Biden for not dropping out sooner so we could've had a presidential primary ofc I blame Trump, Musk, Vance, the far-right. etc.
Yeah cause we couldn't possibly have come to this conclusion without being told so by a streamer. You're the one who's coping
You live online and are dumb
There it is
take your meds
the genocide was ongoing for 13 months before the election
Yeah sure one twitch streamer changed the course of a nationwide election lmao
So funny that you believe paradoxically that he could have changed the election in your favor
No, we believe the democrats could have simply not torched their own campaign in multiple ways
What?
he is reeaaaching. poor guy is fully corncobbed
www.universalclass.com/i/course/rea...
If one Twitch steamer can turn a whole country against your candidate, your candidate should focus on sucking less
What signal? The ask was that Kamala say she would follow existing us law and she refused. What signal was she sending that she was planning to change course on the issue? Telling everyone she would do anything differently from Biden? That feels like the opposite of signaling a change.
Are these times the Dems said they could be moved on Israel in the room with us right now
They did
When? They blocked Palestinian speakers from the DNC. They sent Bill Clinton out to justify mass murder of Palestinians and the annexation of the West Bank. Biden knew that Netanyahu and the IDF were carpet bombing hospitals and civilians and for over a year still publicly said that Israel wasn’t.
The uncommitted movement was just a stain on their campaign.
The uncommitted movement was a group of people using their democratic rights to indicate to the party that they disagreed. That’s called the basic freedom of a democracy. Meanwhile you have yet to cite a single instance of the Dems being ‘moveable’ on Israel.
They fucked up and they admitted so
How did they fuck up? They indicated to the party they wanted a change of direction. Even when the party refused many members of the campaign, including its co founder, told people to vote for Harris.
And I’m still waiting on a single instance of the Dems being movable on Israel like you claimed. I’m starting to wonder if you were lying.
Bro they mentioned Palestine many times on the campaign trail. Just look it up you fucking lazy sack of shit.
they blocked us too, blacklisted us for being against israel. And still the accuse us of hiurting palestineans when its clear they are still for israel. When i was a kid, we called people like that repub licans.
Yeah, America is still deeply pro-Israel and Zionist. Can’t face that without talking about how religion is a stain on humanity, but it’s taboo to even talk about religion. You’ll get branded a Reddit atheist.
This isn’t about religion you fucking Reddit atheist. This is about colonialism.
What religion do you think the colonialists were, you fucking moron?
Do you seriously think that without religion there would never have been colonialism?
See? You can’t even admit that it was a component to colonialism.
right so they are theocratic nutters as well as fascist national socialists, that doesnt make it better
I never said it did, idiot. But in order to change peoples opinion on Zionism, we have to face religion. Unfortunately, religion is only dying as fast as the boomers die of old age.
In order to change people’s opinions of Zionism we need to grapple with colonialism. Religion could vanish and many would still try to justify Zionism.
Not in America. People want war in the Middle East because they think it’ll spark the “end times” and make Jesus come back.
Do... do you think the protests started only when Kamala became the candidate
Do you think that Trump is better than Kamala?
I voted for Harris, not Trump. Now would you care to answer my question instead of fumfering?
Guess not huh
Dems & the Harris campaign never signaled that they were going to move on the issue of Israel. would the Dem Party (& to a greater extent, the US govt) really throw away allying with Israel over one presidential election? ofc not. Harris said she would be no different from Biden (an avowed Zionist).
Normally when I'm signaling my intent to be able to move on an issue, I don't say "I wouldn't change anything".
You people cannot read past anything literal, huh?
ah yes, ignore the evidence of your eyes and ears, swear your undying allegiance to the Party
Well, I hope you’re at least happy with the results of your electoral strategy Maybe if you shout loud enough at Trump he’ll change his mind about genociding all of the Palestinians
gods you're stupid
You helped Trump win. You should be happy with the results.
be very specific as to how I did that.
By creating bad vibes today it magically went back in time and gave trump super powers
You're doing the same thing again!
So I shouldn't believe the presidential nominee's own words on what she would do if she won?
At least if you shout loud enough, Trump might care about the Palestinians, right? 🤭
wow laugh it up while Palestinians are being slaughtered. Fuck you.
You were the one that didn’t want to vote for the only candidate that could have been shamed into changing their stance on Israel. Now you get Trump. What do you want me to say? Protest harder? He doesn’t care lmao.
So the only candidate that could have been "shamed" into changing positions, failed to change positions at all, and that's somehow my fault?
Okay I voted for her and I think you are despicable.
I'm glad this is just so much of a game to you that you can use emojis to smirk about genocide.
I voted for Kamala. You helped Trump win. I’m smirking at your dumbass.
How did I help Trump win?
By delusionally thinking that the Democrats would turn face about Israel one month before the election
So how do you think that makes sense when I voted uncommitted in the primary 6 months before the general election happened?
Trump isn't the opposition party. I expect the opposition party to oppose things. Where did that happen?
Trump won the election. You lost. Now deal with the consequences of your actions.
The consequences of voting for the democrats in a state that the democrats won?
Your rhetoric caused other people in other states to abstain from voting for Kamala Stop pretending like it didn’t.
If my rhetoric is so powerful that it can influence strangers from other states, perhaps the Dems should listen to me then, instead of doing the same thing they've been doing and continuing to lose.
I should believe that the party that wouldn't allow a single, vetted, pro-Harris Palestinian to speak at the national convention would be willing to change their outlook once they got what they wanted?
You’re still coping and it’s sad.
Nah, you're just deflecting because you can't answer a very simple question without being forced to resort to "but you can't trust what they *say*, you have to go based on my person vibes about what I want ro believe that they meant."
Soooooo are you more of an Emmett Kelly clown or a Bozo clown? In your clown training, that is.
Can you read what they literally said? Maybe you just don't want to
Even if you had an example of such a thing, they also said outright (not just "signalled") that they would never stop arming, funding, and defending Israel. So basically, you're complaining that voters didn't read their mind, and instead merely went by what they actually said
Can you give me an example of one of these signals
I’m not going to do that work for you.
It’s your responsibility to support your own claim, not your opponent’s.
Translation: They never said that.
These were the signals Dems were sending - they couldn't have been clearer. www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uVq...
That was just a fake out. The real signals were the ones Kamala was sending me through the catcher in the rye (kill John Lennon)
No because these were the signals dems were sending. bsky.app/profile/fluf...
he's got me blocked, you'll have to post the link separately
I worked that out when I saw the posts together. But thanks for the heads up anyway.
If you aren't going to back up your claims, why should anyone believe you?
Here, loser
That which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence
You are not a “b”. Staying blindly loyal to either Dems or GOP etc, doesn’t lend itself to critical thought. “Never Kamala” could be for only few reasons and none of them are very enlightened or free-thinking. It’s best for people to really look into the policies & policymakers regardless of party.
And both will unironically blame the other for their losses.
I don't blame them. They want fascism delivered in a polite, professional way they can comfortably ignore and they get that about half the time. It's the goofballs that equate that with actual antifascism I have contention with.
Those are the people that don't open their eyes or ears. Keep doing what you are doing and remember your supporters outnumber the haters.
why do you care
AOC doesn't deserve the death threats, but the criticism over her response during the last vote is fair. Her response was stupid, reckless and condescending, almost close in line about what would Hakeem Jeffries would say lol. It's a clear stain for her future and a shameful disappointment.
Now, going serious if you want to push a broad coalition is essential reaching red boundaries first. Even in the example of WWII the allies went to put these lines and let's not forget Cold War started next. If you want to push a real government plan beyond "sacking fascists" is essential this.
It's exhausting and demoralizing to watch those who should be coming together for the one discreet goal of stopping the fascists continue to self-sabotage.
Many on the left view liberals as closet fascists. Not the frothing ultranationalist kind, but the neoliberal capitalist kind that fence-sits.
It really is disheartening when so many people say they "stop fascists" but can't say "Israel is committing genocide" or "Newsom has adopted the fascist position on Trans issues so he needs to be sidelined." "Fight facism, but sidelining fascists in your own ranks is an unacceptable 'purity test'."
All Moments self-sabotage. I point you to the split in the maga movement right now, you probably have a right wing mirror image that is complaining about the very same thing on their side. True success is in rallying anyway. Let the puritans be cannon fodder.
Really I think blocking them is the only effective measure. Most of them don't even vote, they're just loud obnoxious sociopaths using morality as an excuse to be hateful. We should block them all into their own little garden of ineffectual hatred so the rest of us can get real things done.
You know, if they don't agree with what they're reading? Scroll on by. Not difficult, people
Divide and conquer
I don't believe any of them care about stopping fascism, or genocide for that matter. They only care about being able to wield issues as a cudgel of moral superiority that justifies being obscenely rude to everyone they interact with that doesn't bow down to their righteous wrath.
When people make their particular political stripe their entire identity, the ability to think clearly is lost. A person’s ego can wrap itself around anything. Tribalism abounds on the left.
And on the right, and in the purple zones. Holding to facts and truths is the objective. Calling out bs on any political issue when applicable is appropriate. Standing your ground for facts isn't tribalism. We must hold all sides accountable in the fight for our democracy.
Improving the material conditions of humanity is the objective, I would think. Compassion. Equality. Freedom. Holding to facts and truth is necessary to make this happen sustainably. I’ve moved from right to far left over the last 35 years. The amount of infighting on the left was a surprise.
Should say hoping for an independent. I've voted blue my entire life bcuz I'd NEVER vote red, and don't like moderates either bcuz they cave. The last Republican that was good for America was Abraham Lincoln, imho.
The game has changed a lot. Even Eisenhower basically said that any politician that rejects New Deal principles is an idiot. And he warned us of the military industrial complex (a monster he helped create) on the way out. Clinton and Obama, by any objective measure, were further to the right.
IMHO, there always seems to be bits & pieces of what some politicians say that sound right, but hav a back agenda that's not good or is wilfully out of touch to the detriment of all. Yeah, a lot sure has changed! 😉 youtu.be/le0BhD7uftk?... bsky.app/profile/ajna... bsky.app/profile/ajna...
Well, I think Dems have grown up with the fact that they have to vote blue bcuz they see its the lesser of the evils, so surely one can't critique them for being 'wrong'. It's the halo effect. I get it. I'm independent, still waiting for a real independent candidate that can pull the majority.🤷♀️🤦♀️
Yep. The biggest thing I’ve learned is that the hard work of activism is done between elections. Changing hearts and minds, mutual aid, etc. Then when I get to the voting booth, I’ve got a balancing act between longer-term ideals and shorter-term pragmatism. Every election is different.
bsky.app/profile/ajna...
Why would rhe goal need to be discreet ?
To pull off a revolution, you prioritize high standards. You prioritize coherent ideology, and you kick anyone who won't practice it to the damn curb. No we are not going to be inclusive to revisionists and liberals actually.
No. It's exhausting watching revisionists and liberals poison leftist ideology and drive us towards the exact same failures we've always been experiencing. It's exhausting that we can't maintain a standard for our ideology or else resist libs like yourself complain.
Anything extreme from either side of the political spectrum is an issue.
What Americans consider extreme is actually the issue here.
Who is an American?
Define extreme. What is extreme? Because appsrebtly saying "stop doing a genocide" is too extreme for some people.
I most definitely am not saying "stop doing a genocide" - I actually propose quite aweful things for those who are doing so. Every mother should have the joy of raising her children in peace, in every corner of the world. And I do my part, as I can.
Right. But that kinda sentiment does get equated as "purity politics" by more center leaning folks. And I see that as the issue at hand. Center leaning folk are allowing the dem party to move right to the new Overton center, which is skewed to the fascist right.
Dems of today were celebrating Ronald Wilson Regan. A republican who did nothing about AIDS cause he thought it only killed gay people. The man behind much of the neoliberal order of today, following Powell's memo to seize America for corporations.
Dems are following that same legacy. That's what the "lesser" evil gets us, we soon end up with the "greater" evil. Evil adds up.
* im not a democrat. I live in another country '
Cool. This isn't a US specific issue either. Other nations are following this trend. In the UK you have Labour doing the ssme with Tories as an example. Neoliberalism is not bound by national barriers.
Im just saying. Y'all don't live in a vacuum. Our issues are mirriored in other nations. Like the UK.
Probably if you have no idea what I am referring to, but feel upset by it - you might be swinging around out on an extreme. But also you are trying to live in USA, I think currently ? That in itself is a stressful thing. * not everyone on BlueSky lives in the USA - most of us outside there have
The point is what gets considered extreme is also part of the issue. Yeah leftusts are vocal and angry, but for good god damn reasons, the only "left" party is a party of centrists enavling fascists.
And I get not everyone is from the US. Sadly, the US casts a big shadow so what happens in the US tends to also affect other western allies who typically follow the US stepps. Labour capitulating to tories? Sounds like our Dems here.
Neolibetalsim giving way ti fascism isn't a US specific issue, it's a historical one that many left leaning folks refuse to learn from.
If you have time - i am just up and off to work - explain how you are judging my political baus so quickly? I know facism is marching, and Id rather die than live that way - personally
I didn't judge your politics. I mearly asked for you to define "extreme" because this term gets thrown around too often for things as simple as "the left party shouldn't be enabling a genocide, shouldn't be blaming and throwing trans folks under the bus to excuse their political miscalculation."
I have argued with liberals, even across the pond on these issues, and they generally are apathetic to the issues since it doesn't personally affect them.
Hey - these message threads are madly disorganised on my phone - been off socials for months, and Bluesky isn't working on this phone - or it isn't working full stop!
I’m sorry to hear that. I’ve ran afoul of the first group, been swore at and accused of punching left.
I like our Australian approach to political parties: we know they all suck, we know the candidates are imperfect. We don't vote for candidates so much as for the party whose policies best represents our values, even though we know they won't be much good at enacting them.
One benefit of the parliamentary system. Party over the leader, although there were times which the balance is broken cough Thatcher cough Meloni cough BoJo cough.
I'm not calling you a Bword I'm calling you a Genocide Apologist.
Which for the record, makes YOU a fascist. Full stop.
Oh, you're definitely not a commie. You're most certainly a lib, and the folks calling you a commie are libbin' la vida lobotomy.
Angela is really seriously not a liberal. If you go back and look at the liver trail of her permaculture work that is very obvious. She has far more in common with Lucy Parsons than John Locke. Still not a commie or a lib.
Leftists asked Kamala to stop supporting genocide. That isn’t toxic. That’s human.
I question the authenticity & motivations of both of those factions. The flaccid response to the flagrant lawlessness of the regime & 🍌Repubs, coupled with not-so-subtle corruption & self-dealing of the est/corp Dems in leadership, is telling those looking for change, EVERYTHING they need to know.
Are you under the impression that we stopped protesting for Gaza or something? We never quit. You just stooped paying attention so you could keep making comments like this.
Seriously. How are you finding ways to argue with people who don't even disagree with you? That's what Angela was saying. NOTHING will satisfy the quotient, short of political & ideological self-immolation. Fuck that shit. Total self-sabatoge. JFC.
medium.com/nilc/86-time...
www.brennancenter.org/our-work/res...
www.wilsoncenter.org/article/musl...
April 2024 www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024...
Wildness
They are also doing this crap towards trans people as well. It's very disgusting of them to do so. They should know better.
It's never the voters fault when a political party fails to inspire voters. They were warned this shit was unpopular and pushed ahead with it anyways because they wanted a pro business lame duck, anyone who tries to put that on anyone other than the people whose whole job is get votes can blow me.
Some people find it morally repugnant to reduce a genocide to a "purity test".
Some people find it morally repugnant to use Palestinians to justify acting in ways that make you feel really righteous but accelerate their suffering and take us further from stopping the genocide.
Translation ‘I think that being angry about the genocide of a people is not as important as when people are rude to me online. I mean, they called me a bitch! Sure tens of thousands pf children are starving to death, but I’m the real victim here!’
harris had no israel policy to stop genocide. not a single thing to prevent it if we cannot stop genocide abroad caused directly by our own involvement, how would we stop genocide here
It's all performative for you people. Every vote, every moral judgment, all just for show, only to "feel righteous". Jesus, lady. Try actually caring about something one time.
Written like someone who hasn't consumed a single piece of actual Parkrose media. The whole point of this thread started from caring about outcomes instead of purity tests. You are literally doing what you are accusing her of doing right now.
???
When your political strategy of supporting the "lesser of two evils" has led to that lesser evil enthusiastically funding and arming a genocide, it may be time to reevaluate its effectiveness. Especially now that we know there were never red lines in Gaza. That the Biden Administration was genocial
Ok. You've decided to read into my whole political view based on these tweets and clearly haven't looked at how Parkrose has been critical of Democrats or talked about what it would take to actually break our 2 party choke hold. But I'm sure you feel righteous. Grats.
You're trying to justify your tacit support for genocide. That is insane to me.
Damage mitigation in this case (voting for Kamala)absolutely wouldn't prevent genocide. Refusing to participate in damage mitigation absolutely made our support of the genocide worse through Trump.
Worse how? We literally know there were no red lines with Biden bub
Attacking someone who is on record saying voting in general elections is only damage mitigation, and what actually matters is everything else, and promotes pushing far more progressive anti genocide candidates in primaries isn't the gotcha you think it is.
Go read that first condescending as fuck post in this thread. I can understand your need to justify your support for the genocidal Democrats, but have the decency to realize not all of us are going to fall in line behind fucking genocide
"I admit the Democrats are committing genocide, but they are so much nicer about it than Trump."
Also to be clear: my point is at this point all you "harm reduction" voters should look at where we are, and realize decades of harm reduction haven't fucking worked. It's not a viable political strategy. You can't keep supporting the lesser ghouls. It's a losing strategy
All that exists in life are the actions we can take and the actual impact of those actions. Unless you are proposing action that actually saves lives, then I don't care about anything else. Scale of atrocity does matter and Trump accelerated the situation.
I did read it, and I'm not justifying "support". Fighting against every step up until the general and then voting in the general as the just minimal harm reduction act isn't support. It's caring about outcomes more than moral purity.
Your trying to project tacit support for genocide into a business view of an election where the guy who won has accelerated our direct support for that genocide. Unclutch those pearls. You're not making a compelling case.
Dude...we know Biden had no red lines. We know his support for the genocide was as complete as Trump's is. What are you talking about?
wanting a genocide to stop is not a purity test you fucking freak
Also, their suffering has not accelerated. It has largely remained the same.
The US left is in a transition period. Misunderstanding is inevitable. I was blue-no-matter-who until Nov (as a Kamala voter). Now I'm sprinting left. The lists blocking me have hilariously contradictory names. It's not OK that you were called a bitch. You're lovely and I enjoy your videos a lot.
For perspective I didn't vote and don't feel like it would have changed my personal outcomes any. It stills sends a message by not participating
I was mad at people who didn't vote for a while, but at this point I totally get it. Especially if you act politically in other ways.
Yes praxis is a must
Prob transitioning to being formally illegal, but nothing will be done about that electorally if it happens.
I'm a Kamala hater. I voted for her. I felt guilty about it.
I suppose the stance name is " kamala, never again"
The "stand by the DNC no matter what folks" need to STFU. 1) They abandon the Blue when progressives are on the ticket, and 2) when establishment Dems are in power they don't use it. They are what Republicans were 40 years ago and represent the oligarchy.
Right now the DNC is moving from one sheepdog (Bernie) to another (AOC). The job of the sheepdog is to corral the sheep who wander off into Leftist and Progressive politics! Let’s all cry Blue Hoo Hoo!
Uhm. Bernie and AOC are progressive. They are proposing economic policies that Truman pushed. That said, the progressive caucus is weak within the party but the base loves them.
Or are they allowed to say these things to string along progressive voters? What happened under Biden? Better than Trump? Of course, but that’s a really low bar. Two years with power and no progress; Bernie didn’t get any concessions from Biden when his campaign folded and he fell in line. Gaza.
Bernie has great ideas. I love to hear him talk and I’m sad he wasn’t allowed to be the Democrats presidential candidate. I would have voted for him.
Same. While he narrowly lost to Clinton, he was on the road to win the nomination in 2020 before the establishment decided to consolidate behind a corpse. Bernie would have won too. And that's the thing, the establishment would rather lose with Biden than win with Bernie.
We should all get past our specific policies ideals and find common ground to ensure democracy where the people even have the appearance of a choice. Focus on voters rights, congress accountability, and an executive that is surrounded by experts in their field (no media/alcohol).
This won't work (And we have examples overseas). Why? Because: a. Even before this Trump regime, many of those institutions have low approval (Judiciary System was in single digits) and b. People actually wanted a REAL CHANGE. Also returning to Obama-Biden days, when precisely these governments
were uncapable to judge and stop this madness and for "decorum" these leaders did nothing to stop the advance of the far-right (Biden is XXI Century version of Paul von Hindemburg). This time, it's necessary a common program with real red boundaries and final actions even if that means get hands
dirty to fight: -Trials of truth (Or even Nuremberg trials if capable) to keep real responsibility to the oligarchs -Real fight in proper education and media -Transformation of the economic and political system (At least putting the first steps) Otherwise, fascism will return and stronger.
I don't want to return to where we were ...but I want the opportunity to work towards change. If this administration controls all 4 years, we may not be able to undue anything.
I held my nose and voted for Harris in November, but I think it's important not to lose site of the role of the corrupt DNC establishment that forced such a bad candidate onto the ticket despite never winning a single primary. It's a serious problem that needs to be addressed.
It is, but it was entirely delusional to believe that they could tip the public’s stance on Israel in a month before the general election. It’s much easier to get the Dems in power to budge on the issue than it is to get the public to change. But they didn’t win, so we get trump again.
That is factually incorrect. The Dem politicians supported Israel unconditionally. The public overwhelmingly opposed the genocide. You have it completely backwards. Harris would have won had she opposed the genocide.
They signaled multiple times during the campaign that they were piling to change their stance on Israel. They NOTABLY pulled back on the pro-Israel rhetoric and started the process of distancing us from the Israeli regime. But anything short of full disapproval didn’t satisfy you.
Willing*
There is zero chance that if they did that, they would win the election. Too much of the general public is pro-Israel for them to vote Kamala
Dems, very intelligently, stayed away from EVERY WEDGE ISSUE in the campaign, of which was the literal opposite of the Republicans. Rs ONLY campaigned on wedge issues. You’re too delusional to see that.
If Rs only ran on wedge issues and won, why was it "intelligent" for Dems to avoid wedge issues?
You’re asking me why the strategy of divide and conquer is bad for democracy?
You just pointed out that it's a winning strategy. You don't think beating Trump would have been better for democracy?
It’s a winning strategy for the side that doesn’t care about facts. Dems can’t just make shit up because their voter base is at least somewhat intelligent and is willing to call that shit out.
Mamdani just won the Dem primary in the city with the highest Jewish population by being unambiguously against Israel's genocide. You are making an assertion that is not backed by facts.
No, not unambiguously. He’s being smart about his messaging.
He was repeatedly grilled about not being sufficiently pro-Israel and he never backed down or gave in to the pressure. By doing that, he signaled that he had sincere principles and could be trusted. Harris utterly failed to do that.
Yes, even after you harpies went after him, he found a way to satisfy both you and New York’s mostly pro-Israel population. His messaging is on point, but if you weren’t paying attention, so was Kamala’s. She signaled multiple times she was willing to concede on this issue, but you didn’t vote.
Maybe dial back the extreme straw man stuff. I voted for Harris, and I never "went after" Mamdani. I supported him 100%. So you're not even making any sense at all now.
When asked on The View what she would do differently than Biden, she said nothing. What exactly did she say that indicated she would do anything substantive to restrain Israel?
They played their cards right and Hasan Abi ruined it for them. If Dems were to 180 Israel, there goes half their pro-Israel electorate. In fact, the Dems signaled, MULTIPLE TOMES in the campaign that they were willing to pull back on the pro-Israel stance.
Guess what bro? Now there are no politicians in power that both care about Palestine and can do something about it. Great job, you guys.
Because Harris sided with her donors rather than public opinion. She did that.
Yes. Because that’s how you win elections in our broken election meta. You just had to play the game for 1 month. 1 month was all it would have took to win politically. And then you could have put pressure on a political party that cared. Now you get Trump.
You just had to play the game for 1 month And who lost the game in just 1 month?
"That's how you win elections"??? So Harris won? What????
Polling data does not support your assertions. The public sides with the Palestinians in this conflict.
The results of the election say otherwise.
The same was said about getting the Labour Party into power in the UK. Take a look at what they've done since they won power. Maybe some lessons to learn.
Apples and oranges.
who would you have like to see them promote?
But the purists don't want to acknowledge or talk about that. The DNC better understand that if they ever get back in power, we will NOT accept a return to business as usual. The old guard/big money/PACs need to go, we need massive changes top to bottom.
If your definition of purist is anybody with enough of a backbone to draw a hard red line against anybody committing genocide, then you actually just don't have any values and use accusations of purism to make it look like you stand for anything. Only thing you stand for is not standing for things.
The DNC isn't going to "understand" anything so long as they don't face any damn consequences and have an entire army of people like you saying that we will hold them accountable the next time, but this past time we were right to hold our nose and condone.
Oh my God if genocide isn't your red line then you don't have one. Absolutely absurd that you act like you have any bearing over their decision-making process when you'll bend over backwards voting blue, no matter who. Everything you say and do sends the message that they can get away with anything.
Don't feel bad - look where purity tests got the republican party...
Grey/nuanced takes are never welcome and its a shame. We could get so far as a species if we recognize the world and society is full of grey areas.
I’ve come across some of these people too because I want useless Chuck Schumer to resign, yesterday. When I see their comments I think, no wonder Republicans hate Democrats, block and move on, don’t even answer them. They’re smug, vicious, and in my opinion, major baggage moving forward
Goku Is My Dad
I can’t handle it so when I was asked to be a YouTube influencer I said no. I’m to thin skinned and horrible mentally That’s why I appreciate ppl like you. I don’t always agree with you but your opinion matters
You're on the genocide addicts list, nothing you say can ever have meaning. Shut up.
Commies are so authoritarian.
It was always about "No-Genocide". I am not sorry, if that bothers you. Don't know about others but I don't go around calling Women "bitches", if they don't share the same political ideology as mine. But you do sound like a Lib though.
How about an arrogant dipshit who believes they are infallible?
At first I was confused. Then I looked at the comments in this thread. I can see what you mean. Some of these folks are rude AF. I'm guessing it's a lot of bots and trolls.
I am proud to be in such good company.
You can’t fix stupid. They are a LARGE group.
lol I am too insignificant for either groups to come at me. Though excuse my ignorance I really don’t know what the difference between the leftist and the libs are because I thought a liberal was the far end of the left side. Block and move on.
Liberals exist right of center. And conservatives are far right. They all believe in the destructive system of capitalism. They cannot admit that corporations could ever do wrong.
Also, thank you for explaining this to me:)
Well, the person that was attacking me blocked me. Weak debate skills. But what I gather is, they abstained their vote in protest, but I’m the bad guy? Ok lol
Yes. I understand their position and empathize, honestly. Compromising on one’s morals is difficult, but if I can judge their morals on the OUTCOME of their actions, then they acted immorally and irrationally. They genuinely believed that the pro-Palestine movement was bigger than it was.
They genuinely thought that the American public, one of THE MOST pro-Israel population on the planet, were willing to radically change their position 1 MONTH before the election. Hasan Abi pushed this rhetoric and is still coping about it today.
Honestly, I find the blocking infantile because the debate wasn’t heated.they came in with assumptions about me. They attacked me. And then they ran to hide. they can keep hiding.they’re not helping the country with their nonsense. We are past political lines. It is us versus them. Survival mode.
They’re all coping real hard rn. I was watching Hassan Abi‘s reaction to ContraPoints post about Israel, and he was still coping about it. They cannot admit that they lost politically based on a very poorly thought out, shortsighted strategy.
It is all a clusterfuck. But we can’t fix problems until we are out of the hole we are in.
Yeah, and also too many people dont accept that we only have 2 parties in America. You can vote for Kamala or you can vote for Trump. Didn’t vote? This is a vote for Trump Voted “third party”? Good job, you helped Trump win. These people cannot accept this reality.
We need to do away with the electoral collage and every vote is accounted and honored
We do, but we can’t do anything like that if we don’t win elections.
I'm 45 & also can't keep up with the name changes. I've proudly taken the "liberal scum" hate for decades from the right. I've always fought for pro-Bernie ideas & now people come at me if I forget to use the newest term for whatever type I am. It's fucking obnoxious 🙃
I’ve had similar issues in the past so I completely understand. I’m too out there to out there to be a Democrat and too anti-capitalism to be a liberal while a lot of things and socialism appeals to me. The fear of corruption into communism is still instilled in me. Thanks to Reagan.
Liberals exist in the center left, leftists exist further left than that. The terms get kinda muddled together, and can vary wildly depending on country (many countries “liberal” means conservative)
That commonality is a real problem. But I just spent a better part of an hour dealing with the breach of etiquette, I suppose of informing left us that they have white supremacist among them. They don’t like to hear that I guess closed eyes are better than an open one.
Find Greg Stoker on YouTube: Colonial Outcasts and Mint Press News. He has some fantastic ideas about how American people should come together and what the real problems are in America.
best thing about this app is that block button
They’re probably referring to this comment. You’re willing to champion booker despite him accepting AIPAC money, because he put on a show, but when a fascist accidentally has a position that impedes the genocide, you’re against her.
Everyone on the left understands that MGT is a Nazi, but they also understand the roles of the US and Israel in this genocide. to paraphrase literally your words, we don’t support the candidate but their actions. Or in my words, a broken clock can be right twice a day or wrong twice a day.
Lastly, it’s okay to be wrong, as long as you can learn from your mistakes. I have been banned from so many leftist communities, and have been downvoted to oblivion multiple times. Learn from your mistakes, read theory and history, namely from the perspective of the people who aren’t represented
“purity” (to a shitlib) = “principles” Yeah, you’re one.
It wasn't "never Kamala", it was "no genocide". If she'd stood up to Israel that would've changed a lot of minds. But please, don't hesitate to try and lump "Blue no matter what even if they do genocide" crowd with the "please stop bombing our friends and families" crowd if it suits you🤦♀️
How is Trump working out for Palestinians? Or the 14 million people dying bc Trump cut USAID? Or immigrants in gulags? We voted for Kamala bc we had two choices: literal fascism or a less-than-perfect Democrat
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whatabo... you voted for harris for purely selfish reasons. you don't give the tiniest shit about anyone but yourself or you would never support a democrat in the first place given their long list of atrocities
The genocide started under dem leadership - they had a chance to change due to the outrage and chose not to
So now genocide support is being painted as being less than perfect? I can smell the bullshit from here
Less than perfect? This rings so hollow now that we know the Biden Administration had no red lines in Gaza. That their enthusiasm for Israels genocide surprised even the IDF.
Oh I know this song! It's what you all were singing back in 2020 when democracy was at stake for realsies no honestly bro. Want votes? Try this for a change: Food, Housing, UBI. Cause this VBNMW crap is played out.
How is Trump working out for Palestinians you ask? About the same as under Biden. Don't ask questions that have answers you're unprepared for.
www.statista.com/statistics/1...
Fuck off, abled white lady. You voted Harris so you could go back to brunch uninterrupted while families are still ripped apart with no due process
Kamala and the dem leadership had some choices too.
I would have voted for Kamala if she had indicated in any way that she would not continue Joe's gleeful, enthusiastic support of an actual genocide.
So how did you help stop the genocide, exactly? Bc Trump is accelerating it. And committing multiple other holocausts. Or do you not care about the 14 million people who are dying because USAID was cut? Nor immigrants in concentration camps?
Did you spend this much time condemning our last president about this one too?
Or this
I don’t think it’s worth assuming what Harris would and wouldn’t have done (tho I doubt it would have been to sanction Israel), but the message from voters was loud and clear—“we won’t support a candidate who enables genocide”. If they run on that again, they’ll lose again.
You can tell that to Kamala if you meet in the concentration camp where the Republicans put both of you.
Lets just remind you that the ICE concentration camps, including forced hysterectemies (that Trump ended) and family seperation policies were Obama and Biden's fault. NOTHING Trump has done nor is doing now would have been possible without Clinton, Obama, and Biden. Harris would do it too is elected
You are blaming the voters for the obvious, dramatic failures of your party. It is the responsibility of the party to win voters, not scold them when they dare to exercise their free will. Why aren't you questioning why the Dems took so many unpopular positions?
Did you ever consider that actually it's the fault of the people who intentionally lost an election because they valued their continued prosecution of a genocide over any left-wing support?
Because at least now Liberals who were all too keen on sacrificing Palestinians, as well as marginalized groups here at home, might feel an ounce of the suffering their policies cause. There can never be meaningful change so long as western Liberals feel like they can go back to brunch.
If they are willing to sacrifice one group, the odds are fairly high they would sacrifice other groups as well
Bitch = strong woman. They're just confused seeing someone who has set and kept boundaries for others.
There’s certainly a middle ground in that debate. I wouldn’t dare call you a bitch unless you requested it of me.
You ARE a lib if this is the kind of thing that you complain about.
Oh! What? I thought the goal was to save the country from tyranny? From grifters and fascists? I guess I am delusional? WTF!!!😱
I figure if someone’s calling me a b*tch, I’m probably doing something right. 💅🏻 I really appreciate your posts. Please don’t let them get you down. Keep on keepin’ on.