So, I know you're all wondering: Can Pope Leo XIV vote in U.S. elections, and is he still a U.S. citizen? Well, I investigated. religionnews.com/2025/05/09/c...
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As I understand it, he holds dual citizenship in the U.S. and in Peru. So I should think he can still vote.
may 10, 2025, 2:08 pm • 0 0 • view
So interesting!
may 10, 2025, 2:43 pm • 0 0 • view
Well, he's white and make, so I'm guessing he's safe, but I wouldn't suggest he mail it in
may 11, 2025, 2:52 pm • 0 0 • view
I was actually wondering, yes.
may 9, 2025, 11:16 pm • 1 0 • view
Do you have a sense for what his election to pope means for his 2025 taxes?
may 10, 2025, 12:10 am • 2 0 • view
This question is well past its ‘sell-by’ date… but shouldn’t it be Robert Francis Cardinal Prevost?
may 10, 2025, 3:03 pm • 1 0 • view
The State Department’s manual says that a head of state of a foreign state may be considered to lose US citizenship regardless of stated intent. Basically they’re per se in a policy-level position, which makes sense. Looks like it’s not been litigated.
may 9, 2025, 10:16 pm • 6 0 • view
"... may be incompatible ..." Basically this is an unexplored area of the law. However, I'd love to see someone try to remove the Pope's citizenship, either via the Justice Department, or via Congress. This would piss off Chicago area, in addition to the millions of Catholics in the US (and world).
may 9, 2025, 10:43 pm • 5 0 • view
Not sure you’ve been paying attention to US Catholics recently - many have been magafied. I have not. Most of my family (parents, sibs, cousins) has not. But some did vote for this as did some friends and in laws, who are also catholic.
may 9, 2025, 11:08 pm • 0 0 • view
There are still millions of Catholics in the US that have not been MAGAfied. And regardless of MAGAfization, trying to make the first American Pope a non-American is not going to go over well.
may 9, 2025, 11:11 pm • 0 0 • view
Are you catholic? Have you been to mass recently? The homilies are often conservative and borderline political re abortion, lgtbq rights. I don’t know that stripping the pope of US citizenship (which may be legal/required) is a polarizing issue for non maga Catholics.
may 9, 2025, 11:19 pm • 0 0 • view
Theoretically if Prince Archie were too tragically be crowned king of England I would expect him to lose US citizenship as a sovereign of England. The same would apply to Pope Leo XIV who is now the Sovereign of the state of Vatican City.
may 9, 2025, 11:22 pm • 0 0 • view
The State Department can try to revoke King Archie's US citizenship. It is then up to the King to contest it. This is not a well explored area of the citizenship laws, mainly because it has never happened before.
may 9, 2025, 11:29 pm • 0 0 • view
As to the Pope, there is an additional issue. Is he actually a citizen of the Vatican? And, can revoking his citizenship run afoul of his First Amendment rights?
may 9, 2025, 11:30 pm • 0 0 • view
He’s the head of state of the Vatican nation. Someone pointed out that Golda Meir was a US citizen when she was head of govt of Israel, but seems not to have been an issue.
may 10, 2025, 12:42 am • 0 0 • view
I’m not here to argue the law. I’m just pointing out that this is not a galvanizing issue for American Catholics.
may 10, 2025, 12:38 am • 0 0 • view
In (c), the US State Department was the initiator in trying to remove Rabbi Kahane's US citizenship, so he sued to retain it (Kahane v. Shultz). "Clore [the United States Consul in Jerusalem] signed a Certificate of Loss of Nationality of the United States with regard to Kahane on Dec 18, 1984"
may 9, 2025, 10:43 pm • 2 0 • view
That was a parliament member, which is different than the head of state. But it has not been litigated, that’s for sure.
may 10, 2025, 12:44 am • 2 0 • view
Yup. 300 characters is very limiting.
may 10, 2025, 12:45 am • 3 0 • view
My brother-in-law is a lawyer at State (does DHS even have lawyers) and he says yes, he's a citizen unless he renounces it. It would be entertaining to see what the political impact of a then-President-Vance trying to take that away.
may 9, 2025, 11:29 pm • 1 0 • view
"As long as (Leo) maintains his Illinois address,” Dietrich said, “he can continue to do so.” Expats vote without an American address, don't they?
may 9, 2025, 11:02 pm • 0 0 • view
Can he run for POTUS? Yes.
may 9, 2025, 9:58 pm • 1 0 • view
We don’t elect Catholics to that job very often.
may 9, 2025, 10:08 pm • 1 0 • view
He could import the Popemobile to prevent any unfortunate recurrences of past events.
may 9, 2025, 10:19 pm • 1 0 • view
That name isn’t on any government issued ID
may 9, 2025, 10:03 pm • 2 0 • view
Certainly not on his Real ID
may 9, 2025, 10:05 pm • 3 0 • view
But can a pope be president?
may 9, 2025, 10:01 pm • 1 0 • view
He’s eligible but he’d have to argue that is a part of his mission on Earth, which theologically feels like a stretch. He’s the last judge of that, so he could.
may 10, 2025, 5:47 am • 0 0 • view
Yes. As long as they were born in the US and are over 35.
may 9, 2025, 10:08 pm • 2 0 • view
Well, they have to have lived in the US for the last 14 years, which is unlikely for a pope.
may 9, 2025, 10:58 pm • 1 0 • view
That "last" is not in the constitution. It's at least 14 years in their lifetime, this which Pope has done. ... "neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States."
may 9, 2025, 11:02 pm • 0 0 • view
Can you have dual citizenship with vatican city and US?
may 9, 2025, 10:12 pm • 1 0 • view
Yes. The Pope is already a dual citizen: US and Peru. There is not limit.
may 9, 2025, 10:26 pm • 2 0 • view
I read he became a Peruvian citizen.
may 9, 2025, 10:44 pm • 0 0 • view
He is *also* that, but retained (and, it seems, retains) dual citizenship.
may 9, 2025, 10:44 pm • 4 0 • view
Thank you for pointing out that SCOTUS decision. It's a helpful addition. I'd also add the Titles of Nobility Amendment, more specifically that while it passed Congress it was never ratified.
may 9, 2025, 11:59 pm • 0 0 • view
Given how early on in our history it was proposed (1810-ish), that implies it was understood at framing that citizenship was not lost just through taking a foreign title. Also, Leo is eligible to be elected President.
may 9, 2025, 11:59 pm • 0 0 • view
You mention that he's head of state, but it's more pronounced even than that: As sovereign of the Vatican State, he's an absolute monarch. Which would mark the first time a foreign monarch voted in a US election. Wild times.
may 9, 2025, 11:08 pm • 5 0 • view
You may be correct about foreign monarch in particular, although, technically, there has been a foreign head of state who was also a naturalized U.S. citizen (who eventually renounced it): www.nytimes.com/live/2025/05...
may 9, 2025, 11:11 pm • 3 0 • view
Did Lisa Halaby, who became Queen Noor of Jordan, renounce her US Citizenship?
may 9, 2025, 11:28 pm • 0 0 • view
There's also Grace Kelly, who did not renounce her citizenship as Princess of Monaco. While not sovereign in her own right, she was certainly royalty and the consort of a monarch.
may 9, 2025, 11:15 pm • 4 0 • view
This makes me wonder two more things: 1. Does becoming pope violate the emoluments clause? 2. Is Leo actually a triple citizen? US, Peru, and Vatican?
may 9, 2025, 11:38 pm • 1 0 • view
Thank you! We were discussing this at the dinner table last night.
may 9, 2025, 9:55 pm • 1 0 • view
The Pope probably has to submit a FBAR every year. Which could be a nightmare, if the US considers him to be in control of the Vatican bank, and other financial, accounts.
may 9, 2025, 10:23 pm • 2 0 • view
And file income taxes and pay any owed. The Vatican doesn't have a tax treaty with the US, so he may owe taxes to both countries (unless the tax treaty with Italy applies).
may 9, 2025, 10:23 pm • 1 0 • view
But he probably doesn't pay income taxes in the Vatican. However, the fun begins with the US tax returns. Remember that the US pretty much taxes all income, and allowances, and other stuff. What is his salary? How much is the Pope paid?
may 9, 2025, 10:23 pm • 2 0 • view
What is the fair market value of the papal apartment? Which, after all, is sitting on just about the primest piece of real estate in Rome. What about the Popemobile (company car)? The good news is that he can probably collect Social Security, as his actual income from working is fairly low.
may 9, 2025, 10:23 pm • 3 0 • view
the pope doesn’t get a salary. the vatican pays for his food, clothing, travel, whatever.
may 9, 2025, 11:11 pm • 1 0 • view
Would the IRS see it that way? It is, bizarrely, now an Actual Question.
may 9, 2025, 11:12 pm • 0 0 • view
Depends on if he collects his salary. Francis didn't. Also depends on how the IRS looks at the perks: the papal apartment, the popemobile, etc. But, if the Pope collects his social security, then that is taxable by the US.
may 9, 2025, 11:16 pm • 0 0 • view
"While the Pope may technically be entitled to a modest salary – estimated at around €2,500 a month (approximately £2,150)"
may 9, 2025, 11:14 pm • 0 0 • view
"Instead, the Vatican provides what is essentially an all-expenses-paid existence. ... Although the Pope does not earn a salary ...." as I understand it, he has budgets for different purposes, not a sum he can use however he wants. looks like an irs nightmare.
may 9, 2025, 11:27 pm • 0 0 • view
I'm sure the Vatican has resources that will deal with this. It's not like the Pope is going to sweat out the Jun 15 or Oct 15 deadlines doing his US tax returns at the Papal Desk.
may 9, 2025, 11:32 pm • 0 0 • view