Physical strength , it’s a no brainier, have you ever played any physical contact sport at a high level?
Physical strength , it’s a no brainier, have you ever played any physical contact sport at a high level?
What gives the advantage of physical strength?
While you are thinking - this is also irrelevant. And kind of misogynistic. If a weaker man at the same weight level decided to fight a stronger man, no one would be hand wringing. If everyone consented to be there, there’s no problem.
Not in the slightest bit misogynistic, And please don't try to insult me, I support trans rights as much as you, But I am realistic when it comes to nature V nurture especially to physical strength, And why do you keep using a boxing analogy?
I’m not. I’m criticising your argument. Pick any sport. What is it that makes men more physically strong than women of the same weight?
Testosterone and male puberty
So trans women take testosterone blockers… Puberty affects people in different ways. At some point we are comfortable accepting various phenotypical differences in sports.
Transwomen still benefit from male puberty.
As I said, there are loads of genetic and phenotypical advantages which can’t be accounted for. You going to exclude people of West African descent from sprinting? East African from distance?
No because that would be racist
Exactly. So we can tolerate a degree of genetic inequality in order to not be bigots.
Its a known fact that Kenyan athletes are superior than most at middle distance running because they train at altitude.
*many trans women
Post-pubertal transition leaves most male advantage intact. Please see our paper which reviews the science: onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/...
What degree of inter group benefit would you be prepared to accept, given that a) there is clearly large genomic and phenotypic variation within groups and b) between groups? Or is this not really about notions of fairness?
I'm not opposed to adding categories if people want them. There could be height categories for basketball for example. They would still need to be within sex categories (as per weight categories) given that height for height & weight for weight males have a significant advantage over females.
That wasn’t the question. Should non trans women at the far end of the bell curve be banned from competing on the basis of fairness?
I suppose it's down to Mother Nature, ( basically) There’ll always be the odd exception to the rule, imagine if our brilliant lionesses ( football ) team played against the mens team, or Rugby, cricket etc, I'm not a gambling person but I'd bet my house on the men to absolutely thrash the ladies
Trans women are women. Reasons are here as is the standard debate. bsky.app/profile/brap...
100% agree, but there are generic differences which at this present time medical intervention isn't able rectify.
Like there are for East Africans at distance? Or West Africans at sprinting?
Sorry Dont understand this logic in this discussion
If we are banning women who take every step to level the playing field but still have some genetic advantage, then why doesn’t that apply to other sports where groups of people have a genetic advantage?