This unfortunately won‘t happen with Starmer as leader. He has planted himself firmly on the side of „concerned citizens“ that are harassing refugees across the country.
Replies
Yes we'll he can be replaced faster than another party can be built. There's one show on the road here.
aug 26, 2025, 2:05 pm • 2 0 • view
When have Labour party members *ever* removed a leader?
aug 26, 2025, 2:17 pm • 0 0 • view
Members can't remove a leader, only MPs can.
aug 26, 2025, 2:23 pm • 0 0 • view
And let's face it, why would the little people be entitled to have a view?
aug 26, 2025, 2:27 pm • 0 0 • view
I don't think giving the labour party membership defact veto power over the prime minister of the united kingdom is a good idea, Norbert.
aug 26, 2025, 2:42 pm • 2 0 • view
(a) It isn't a veto. It'd take a lot to make it happen. (b) There have been any number of Labour leaders who never made it to No 10. But more fundamentally, isn't it always amazing that what works really quite well in other countries in Europe should absolutely be out of the question here?
aug 26, 2025, 2:47 pm • 0 0 • view
It is a veto. You want the membership of the labour party to be able tbring down the prime minister if they want. No. That isn't parliamentary democracy. It isn't democracy at all. I get b) but that isn't what we are talking about here, you don't want it just for opposition times.
aug 26, 2025, 2:49 pm • 0 0 • view
Of course in the UK the leader of the party *must* be the Prime Minister so it must always be this way and cannot conceivably be any other way even though in other places it often is but let's not go there. He's elected to represent the views of those who *are* the party. If he stops doing that...
aug 26, 2025, 2:53 pm • 0 0 • view
He isn't elected to represent the views of the people in the party. You don't understand our form of government.
aug 26, 2025, 2:57 pm • 0 0 • view
Well, MA in PolSci but what do I know. Have a nice day.
aug 26, 2025, 3:01 pm • 0 0 • view
He's elected to represent a constituency, and wins his status as pm because he commands the confidence of the house. What you want is to remove parliamentary sovereignty and replace it with the freaks of the labour party membership! Hell no.
aug 26, 2025, 2:57 pm • 0 0 • view
That‘s something I agree with. The question now is whether MPs remain cowards in the face of the fascist right or whether they remember that their first duty is to the country and not to Starmer.
aug 26, 2025, 2:46 pm • 0 0 • view
The PM has patronage. You want a government role, no matter how insignificant? Keep your mouth shut. They will not.
aug 26, 2025, 2:48 pm • 0 0 • view
Patronage powers don't help when you don't have enough jobs to give out and your MPs don't think they have a chance of getting reelected.
aug 26, 2025, 2:51 pm • 0 0 • view
Well, there's two options - either you have a small majority which means 40-50% are on the Government pay roll. Or you have a huge majority and then you don't really have to care about 40-50 rebellious MPs.
aug 26, 2025, 2:54 pm • 0 0 • view
How can you be theoretically conscious and not recognise how what you are saying directly contradicts the lived experience of the last few months lol.
aug 26, 2025, 2:56 pm • 0 0 • view
When Hitler passed the enablement act socialist MPs voted no, despite being threatened, despite knowing it would pass anyway. Many of them went into the first concentration camps. Being elected comes with great privileges but also with the duty to make the ultimate sacrifice when needed.
aug 26, 2025, 2:54 pm • 0 0 • view
Yes, but then you've got people like Torsten Bell who was a huge critic of the two child benefit policy and now he's an ardent defender. Funny how that works, isn't it?
aug 26, 2025, 2:56 pm • 0 0 • view
Are you two seriously, seriously comparing the labour party to parties that passed the enabling act. Can you get a fucking grip.
aug 26, 2025, 2:58 pm • 0 0 • view
I could also point to David Lammy. From saying in parliament that Brexit is a con to going fishing with American Nazis. And no, the holiday pictures with Vance were not a required part of the brief of a foreign secretary. Other Europeans did not debase themselves like this.
aug 26, 2025, 2:59 pm • 0 0 • view
There is no chance to replace Starmer anytime soon. He has a right grip on the party machine.
aug 26, 2025, 2:08 pm • 4 0 • view
He can be replaced whenever MPs become unconvinced he's going to be able help them keep their seat. I imagine the 2026 local elections give a decent time for this. What exactly is your alternative timo? Pretend Jeremy Corbyn can spin a party of malcontents up? Pretend the greens can win?
aug 26, 2025, 2:12 pm • 6 0 • view
Bring in PR to ensure there can not be a Fascist take over of the UK. Labour members voted for it.
aug 26, 2025, 9:14 pm • 0 0 • view
The plp failed to remove corbyn cos, y'know, lp rules mean it's virtually impossible to remove a leader no matter how shit he is. Hence 2019.
aug 26, 2025, 7:44 pm • 0 0 • view
We’re in this mess because of this kind of thinking. Labour clearly are not doing enough to win the next election or beat away Reform. They’re paving the way. The alternative starts when you stop giving unconditional support to people who are acting like fascists. It’s as simple as that.
aug 26, 2025, 4:57 pm • 7 0 • view
I think if you think that labour are acting like fascists you need to get a reality check.
aug 26, 2025, 5:16 pm • 2 0 • view
The war against basic rights for trans people is not that of a party that values human rights for all parts of society.
aug 26, 2025, 5:22 pm • 2 0 • view
The position is bad on trans rights. It's not fascism.
aug 26, 2025, 5:24 pm • 2 0 • view
The denial of basic rights for vulnerable groups is one of the big red flags on the way to fascism.
aug 26, 2025, 5:26 pm • 5 0 • view
Do you think the labour party is a fascist party yes or no? Let's get this over with quickly
aug 26, 2025, 5:28 pm • 0 0 • view
I will answer that. Willingness to use elements of, yes. Evidence: Ignoring the GFA Ignoring the rule of law for the TCA Lack of citizens rights regarding trans & EU / UK citizens Supporters of genocide Engaging in performative racism Watching people drown in the channel Treatment of aslyum seekers
aug 26, 2025, 5:39 pm • 1 0 • view
Recent decisions with regards to Gaza protests by Labour are not that of a party that has freedom of speech at its core.
aug 26, 2025, 5:20 pm • 1 0 • view
Ok but that isn't fascism, Timo.
aug 26, 2025, 5:23 pm • 0 0 • view
Fascism is not a binary state but a slippery slope. Every such decision leads us further down this slope at which end Farage is waiting.
aug 26, 2025, 5:25 pm • 1 0 • view
Fascism as a meaning and the meaning isn't "socially conservative politics with a long history in the labour party and in social democracies more generally". The policies are bad, the politics are bad, you do not need to invoke the spectre of fascism and it's crimes to say that.
aug 26, 2025, 5:29 pm • 0 0 • view
It's much more relevant to compare this government to labour in the 60s and 70s rather than Nazi Germany and fascist Italy. That this needs to be said is ridiculous.
aug 26, 2025, 5:30 pm • 0 0 • view
why do you think it is that you believe Starmer is firmly on the side of those harassing refugees across the country, and yet those very same people believe Starmer has established a two-tier justice system that singles them out for draconian persecution, where they are 'political prisoners'?
aug 26, 2025, 4:04 pm • 0 0 • view
That's not hard. Because Starmer isn't coming out to forcefully oppose these things, and because the right have lost their ever loving minds.
aug 26, 2025, 4:05 pm • 1 0 • view
so if Starmer isn't coming out to forcefully oppose these things, why do the people doing those things despise Starmer and believe he is abusing his power to create a two-tier justice system that persecutes and silences them as political prisoners?
aug 26, 2025, 4:19 pm • 0 0 • view
Because the right works on the principle of the friend enemy distinction. They select and enemy and organise against it. What you are essentially asking is 'why are Starmers far right political opponents dishonest and cynical' and I mean, I don't know what to tell you bud?
aug 26, 2025, 4:22 pm • 0 0 • view
so who is Starmer on the side of, and trying to appease?
aug 26, 2025, 4:27 pm • 0 0 • view
He's trying to mitigate the loss of voters to reform. He's trying to keep the people that voted for him last year that are now intending to vote for reform. That's who he is trying to appease. Any more questions ?
aug 26, 2025, 4:35 pm • 0 0 • view
There are few Labour voters from last year who may now vote Reform. The bleed out to Lib Dems and Green is a much bigger danger.
aug 26, 2025, 4:39 pm • 0 0 • view
Yes, but again. They think they can lose them 2:1 because we stack up voted in cities and a lot of those votes that are being drained are being drained in cities. Ultimately they think enough of those will back labour inf a Farage Vs Starmer election.
aug 26, 2025, 4:45 pm • 0 0 • view
and are these the same people demonstrating outside hotels?
aug 26, 2025, 6:29 pm • 0 0 • view
I'm sure theres some overlap but not a lot as the number of people that actually demonstrated is so low.
aug 26, 2025, 6:42 pm • 0 0 • view
so Starmer isn't trying to appease the people demonstrating outside hotels?
aug 26, 2025, 6:44 pm • 0 0 • view
No. Let me explain. Do you know what a set and a subset is? As in apples are a subset of fruit but if I say I want a bit of fruit I might mean a strawberry. Some of the people that voted labour in 2024 will be protesting - it's a tiny subset. There will also be a tiny subset of serial killers.
aug 26, 2025, 6:55 pm • 0 0 • view
Starmer is afraid of bleeding votes to Reform. He thinks when pushed liberals will vote for Labour no matter what. So it is the Reform vote he has to go after. But all he does is making Farage more electable by pivoting to the same slogans and the liberals will go to Lib Dem or Greens.
aug 26, 2025, 4:08 pm • 1 1 • view
He's making the bet that because libs are packed into cities he can lose 2 to the left for every 1 to the right. Libs suffer from being inefficient. The progressive eighth of the country is even more packed into fewer constituencies
aug 26, 2025, 4:11 pm • 0 0 • view
But what he needs is the swing suburbs. Labour only won here because of Lib Dem voters lending their votes to Labour where efficient to do so. No chance that he gets this coalition back.
aug 26, 2025, 4:15 pm • 1 0 • view
Yes I think they have it wrong, but that is apparently part of the theory of how to beat farage.
aug 26, 2025, 4:17 pm • 0 0 • view
Or simply Westminster bubble. It reminds me of May trying to find a Brexit deal that her own far right MPs would like. It was clear that this was impossible. Yet, she kept on trying until they ousted her. I think the Westminster bubble is real and lets people lose grip of reality.
aug 26, 2025, 4:20 pm • 0 0 • view
ok, and what about my question?
aug 26, 2025, 4:12 pm • 0 0 • view