I mean... I guess that's actually a hopeful metaphor in and of itself? The Classic is still what they sell by the siloful, while the New has been nothing but a punchline for 40 years...

I guess I should say ‘responding to truth.’ When societies stop responding to truth in sustainable practices (fascism causes that) they crumble. You can HAVE a cult and flourish but can’t be Jonestown. We’re getting Jonestown now. You can believe the rainfall is from gods if you notice WHEN it comes

That's a really good way to put it. And I do think most of the priests of this cult believe the bullshit too. Again, the difference between this and Jonestown is that Jonestown had a leader; AI is just a mirage.

Yeah but it’s not truth-seeking. It cannot comprehend truth. That’s another way similar characteristic to fascist leaders and cult leaders that makes them so dangerous.

How truth operates in society is one of my lifelong questions. Societies can work BEAUTIFULLY while organized around untruths (kings, priesthoods). But there still has to be a core way of addressing truth that works or they fall apart. Maybe there’s ‘survival truths’? AI will threaten that one.

Yeah, it seems like the most salient feature of AI is that it has no core, and will say anything to anyone. In that way it's actually really Trumpian.

Yes. 20 years ago in class discussion of ‘lying’ popped up and I found almost everyone in the class prefers to be lied to if the truth is upsetting. I hadn’t know I was an outlier on that. Believing lies or being in a fog of untruth is a disturbing idea to me even if nothing happens. I NEED to know.

Kind of interesting they were so self-aware though! I would expect everyone to say they want the truth, and then in the moment to prefer the lie...

Can’t say why it sounds horrifying—maybe a similar thing to society for the self (to me)? If your primary thing in life is to BE then you base this on lies where’s the feedback? You aren’t a self-formed being you are instead a created/manipulated being. Tho yeah, OK —lots of my beliefs may be false.

They started giving lots of examples and for each example I would say ‘Nobody better lie to me about THAT!’ And they’d say ‘oh, I definitely want to be lied to about that.’ Eventually agreed if they felt good with lies but bad with truth they prefer lies. Even living in an illusion!

Wow, that's super interesting! I'm with you, I have a hard enough time getting my bearings even when people aren't lying to my face.