If people who claim to value expertise are making choices purely on aesthetic grounds, you’re fudged already. Not to mention if that would be enough to tip the balance versus policy that is plain bad.

It doesn't matter what words/phrases Dems use. Conservatives will just pretend. Are Dems even using the type of language being criticized?

My thread already addressed this point

Yes, but you seem to agree that they have a point because this language is coming from Democratic-type places, like academia. We can't let them dictate language that isn't even being directed at them just because they feel threatened by Fox telling them how scary new words are.

They have a little bit of a point bc people encounter this language in places that are not fox news

Yes, likely from people downstream from Fox and their ilk. Every disfavored use of language will be called too extreme or politically correct or woke or pretentious nonsense, rather than honestly address the concepts behind those terms. These are not honest critiques about language.

Of course the Dem coalition accepts smart, insightful, experts like Tom. Why? Simply because he has allegiance to our Constitution & requisite honesty & energy for major contributions. Many "legacy conservatives" are just fine since their policies are positive & are open to a diversity of ideas.

To put it another way, for every example of a Dem going over board with language like that, you can find an example of a Republican being arrested for what’s on their hard drive, or playing footsie with Nazi, and if it’s close, we’ve got bigger problems than language

By the same token, if people are so triggered by language like that that they’d vote MAGA (not Tom, I’m assuming), I’m not sure it matters. It will be important to hold Republicans accountable, and a voter who can’t decide between fascism and hearing the word cisgender isn’t much help

And by extension all Americans are royall f——d given the current GOP.

Totally agree, so freaking tired of the “deep dish” lefties who live in this fantasy purist world. BLUF: the larger the tent the more room for everyone not MAGA. The opposition is building a turnout machine, what are u building.

Truth!

Tom Nichols is voting blue no matter who. If he doesn’t then he is no better than those hippie leftists who stayed home in 2024. Those are the rules Tom himself made.

The only one I use with any regularity is “incarcerated people.” And that definitely comes from a class I took for my JD, “Rethinking Policing.” I regularly work with incarcerated folks, so I talk about them more often than the average person. But I haven’t completely abandoned the term “inmates.”

In this climate of fascism and authoritarianism the progressive wing of the dem party should lighten up on the purity testing. The ship has to be righted or we all will go down with it.

I think what a number of the pundits like him miss is that raising the salience of this kind of thing is just left punching to make themselves feel better if the politicians themselves aren’t using this language. Getting a random artist inspired to vote for dems carries more weight than him

Does it? If that person’s ideals and interests are already aligned with the Dems? And we are all doing punditry on here.

I think that it does because dems struggles seem to be with low info voters. You have to give them red meat that they can talk about amongst their less engaged peers. That is what I would consider to be the biggest difference between the 2020 election and 2024 inside the campaign itself.

Thanks, Joe. And Sarah spends a lot of time talking to voters.

It is easy to find lists like this for corporations too: spitballing, networking, rice bowls…

"reach out" We will reach out to you. What, you are going to grab me?

Corporate / office cheerleader slang is the worst slang.

Sarah is a Republican! You’re an independent! Neither of you are Democrats! I’m a Democrat! The Democratic Party should be paying more attention to us actual Democrats than folks like you and Sarah, who clearly want Democrats to fail.

You are losing the plot here. It’s democracy vs authoritarianism. Party cult is what got us here on the Republican side. Democrats need a broad coalition to save this democracy and I’m glad Sarah and Tom are standing firm on the pro democracy side.

@sarahlongwell25.bsky.social seems to have more in-depth knowledge of voters than just about anyone I’ve seen and she mentions the language often comes up in her focus groups. When I’ve asked people why it bugs them, they generally say that it makes them feel judged, lectured & looked down upon.

That's because they *are* being judged and looked down upon. Justifiably. However, doing so silently, i.e. to oneself and not out loud to MAGAts, is far more effective than alienating them and validating what Faux Noise & other right-wing outlets are telling them.

Feel sad for people who lack confidence and fear they are being judged because of a few words. Maybe any words used will make them feel this way? Politics will not give them confidence. They need to deal with it on their own.

Yeah, I agree. But do you want their votes?

Why is language above 6th (?) grade not understood? My grandfather and father (10th and 12th grade) did not have this problem. Seems dumbing down education and newspapers enabled this. Usually people's reading comprehension is broader than spoken words. We allowed this denigration of education.

Honestly, I’m not sure. I think social media has a lot to do with it. But I can say that a lot of the manual/online help I wrote had to be targeted around the 7th grade level. Mostly because instructions needed to be processed quickly, so the writing had to be clear, concise, and easy to read.

It's absurd to think there's any "solution" to a "problem" that doesn't involve Democratic pols. Electeds and candidates don't use erudite rhetoric, nor do most party activists. Voters are shaped by distorted media if attributing this language to our party.

I'd posit that they feel looked-down upon and judged because in fact they haven't bothered to educate themselves about the real meanings and societal impacts of what these terms are referring to. And actually don't care to, because that would require an honest evaluation of their positions.

Or maybe they just don’t like it bc it’s weird

I'm not sure that actually negates my point.

Yeah i guess we are all just smarter than them

They don’t get it’s this attitude that turns off voters. These are the same people who demand THEIR VOTES “be earned!”

Look, the fact is that the country is being quite obviously burnt to the ground. It seems a stretch to say that those who still support this dangerous administration are doing so because their feelings are getting hurt by random Dems sometimes using wonky academic terms. 1/2

That's another smokescreen being thrown up to defend what they know is indefensible. But hey, if folks think that debating which terms we should and shouldn't be using and purging the latter from any public utterances is going to somehow move the needle, then go for it. Honestly, I'm skeptical. 2/2

I mean, we are. We should probably just accept the fact that we're trying to win over dumb people, and smart people aren't typically good at doing that.

Most people are just busy trying to raise their kids, pay the bills, & have a little fun. Not everyone has a lot of spare time.

This.

Fucking grow up.

That’s funny that this language comes up as an issue when I don’t know anyone that talks like this and we are crazy progressives. I can see why bugs people- it bugs me but jfc compared to fascism this seems like nitpicking

Most people aren’t even aware of how close we are to an authoritarianism. They’re so busy living their lives, working & raising their families, that they’re not paying attention to anything else going on in the world.

This is such a good point. It’s important to remember. It’s also why it’s important to speak up. Not in a confrontational way, but in a way that evokes conversation

It isn’t as egregious as fascism at all, but we have to acknowledge that it conveys a tone that turns people off to a person or cause. I agree that I don’t hear nearly as many people using it as I used to hear. But the ones who still do can stand out and then get amplified by the right.

If they don’t have examples, they make it up anyways, but I get your point and we probably can never go wrong listening to Tom Nichols.

We are never going to get to the true MAGAs, but the regular people we do want to sway, are not going to be swayed with this. Take heteronormative, for example, which is not even a concept to most in a country that identifies as 80-85% straight. Meeting people where they are is good politics.

80-85? Lol. It’s more like 99-99.5

We are all snowflakes, burdened by the constant perceived slights of a world that refuses to acknowledge how special we are.

Trump voters complain they feel spoken down to or lectured. Same dipshits who spent their HS years skipping skool & holding keggers rather than learning, jeered at "nerds" who studied, got into college & made something of themselves. Go back to any 15 yr reunion & they're still whiners & losers. 🤷‍♀️

These all seem to be fair points, but are we really just rearranging deck chairs while the Titanic sinks?

We can do more than one thing at a time. We've been generally poor at messaging, probably in large part seeking to avoid annoying some donors, consultants, constituent groups. Contracted vs expanded. This disaster has been coming for years; we've been shortsighted, blind. No time to f around.

Maybe. But at least we can try to keep the damn thing from sinking or do anything we can to get as many as possible on the lifeboats.

Schumer talked about Hegseth being inebriated. Say drunk, slammed, or trashed. Talk like everyday Americans.

Tom Nichols hates Indian food and is a weird cranky pundit. He is not an everyday American. The idea that forbidding lists of words will help Dem messaging is idiotic, and it’s telling that this idea is only coming from Republicans and conservatives like Sarah and Tom.

Actually, as someone who has done a LOT of voter outreach and canvassing in the last election, and heard a lot of those words thrown back at me by economically gettable voters

Tom and Sarah are right.

And as an election official who’s run a polling place for the past three years, the stuff random voters say is anecdote unless polled in a systematic way. Tom and Sarah are wrong. Democrats in power do not use these words. And the data shows that they are wrong: bsky.app/profile/koes...

But to substantively address your point: Voters DO (incorrectly) believe Dems in power use these words! That’s the real issue here: decades of Republican misinformation. A central goal of Dems should be to combat that misinformation. We can’t if we keep listening to Tom and Sarah repeat it.

I will say-it was ONE Mpls council member after George Floyd was murdered who said “defund the police” and ALL Dems were labeled as wanting to do that across the country (when many said police reform at best) so yes, misinformation is bought by most Americans

This is the problem! And folks like Tom Nichols are over here chiding Democrats about nomenclature while Republicans burn the republic to the ground. It’s genuinely just shockingly condescending.

I have been screaming about rampant GOP mischaracterization of Democrats, and their stranglehold on both corporate and social media, ever since Newt and the arrival of Fox. Tom and Sarah are just saying "Don't Make It Easier for Them. The nomenclature helped them get the power to burn it down.

(Also: if you’re a Democrat, you should reconsider listening to fascist conservatives like Tom Nichols.)

This is the core of the Democrats messaging issue. Like it or not, a large swath of voters have a working vocabulary that does not include regular use of a thesaurus. When you speak TO someone not AT them, it’s respectful to do so in commonly used terms.

Really? So despite what Tom can see with his own eyes, he won't vote for democrats because he is offended by certain words? Or finds them to be off putting to certain voters?

Whatever man, you probably can’t even name one Whitesnake album.

No i can't

Tom has and will vote for Dems.

Tom did not vote for Trump in any election. The democrats have a bigger problem with the far left who wouldn’t vote for the democrat and said they were fine with Trump “for 4 years”. We’ll soon find out if it’s just till 2028 or if we will get to vote again.

I didn't say he did. Look, I agree language is important in connecting with voters. Just don't think it is the main issue. Lack of cohesive messaging on a regular basis is more critical. And that's the real problem

Words? Maybe. We should be talking about the folly of running a woman for President, in particular a black woman. My rural/small town F&F flipped out over Clinton and Harris. They are "moderates" and while they think words are silly, they'll only vote for a straight white male for President.

Afaiac, 'gettable' voters are just fantasy. If these goofy-ass terms is what caused people to not vote against a Trump regime, there's serious fucking issues that won't be solved by ditching them. Your only hope is financial Armageddon setting the mob over the edge. newrepublic.com/post/198988/...

Yup. 💯

why does someone with a PHD get to dictate what us common people understand?

Well said in your replies. And yes if we can’t capture the “Nichols vote” Dems will never ever ever ever ever win

Home run

Agreed. I find it sad and scary that we can't formulate some sort of message like "everyone should have freedom in their personal life" and "everyone should live with dignity" that creates space and protection, but also doesn't create talking points around new acronyms

By the same token, I’ve spent inordinate amounts of time saying to Palestine and Trans supporters they need to think carefully about voting their best interests over their specific issues. As a nation we lose when perfect becomes the enemy of the good.

I know who you’re talking about. His name rhymes with Davin Twosome. HE THREW TRANS PEOPLE UNDER THE BUS! GAZA! GAZA! GAZA! HE HATES THE UNHOUSED!

Yeah. They jumped on me when I said Newsom supports transgender people & their rights, he just doesn’t believe transgender females should be allowed to compete in women’s sports competitions against cisgender women.

They JUST CAN’T SEPARATE THE TWO. It’s infuriating.

It's in everyone's interest to get these people out of power....we can argue bout all of the old dem vs gop shit later

It’s really hard right now; essentially, the entire rational political spectrum, fiscal conservatives through progressives, need to all pile into the D party right now. Don’t exclude anyone. Focus on common American values. Citizenship. Helping neighbors.

I'd agree if he had better taste in music.

Question: is it actually ‘academic’ language, or is it ‘academic sounding’ language? Academic language is usually very precise- oxidization vs burning. But where is that increased precision with ‘unhoused’? It’s euphemistic. Same with involuntarily confined’- like trapped in a closet?

It’s academic plus corporate speak If u bring up these terms at thanksgiving u sound like a pretentious idiot

Trust me, this stuff was born in seminar rooms

Of course, but that doesn’t make it actually academic- same way if you produce any old sparkling wine in Champagne it doesn’t make it Champagne. But the tourists won’t know the difference unless told.

It literally, historically, comes from academia and activism, which are highly interrelated

Literally created by academics in academic settings.

Again, without academic rigor, it doesn’t matter who said it. Academia is a discipline not a social class, it is a practiced discipline, with peer review and empiricism, otherwise it’s just… an opinion. These terms are not precise, not empirical, nor peer reviewed. A meme agreed upon.

It is very much a type of social class

It certainly is pretended to be over here, but having grown up with hardcore academics (who actually did things, that got peer reviewed, that have shaped this world), it’s alien to me. There is an artifice occurring. The performance of being an academic vs engaging in academia.

But also, what's the problem? Everyone agrees Dems don't use these words regularly.

Read the thread.

It's 4 messages long. I read it. The question stands. We agree dem candidates don't use the terms. What's the problem?

Toms always gonna vote against Trump cause he's not a fucking moron and at his core values democracy. So, he's in the coalition whether the leftists want him or not 🤣