Two points worth noting on the Farage stuff today. 1. The Tories have completely ceded the August opportunity to get publicity when govt slows down to Reform. Nothing to suggest they're not headed fast towards oblivion. 2. Labour look even more lost than before. Paralysed with indecision and fear.
How long till the ECHR suspension Lord blunkett is calling for happens I give it a month.
How long till the ECHR suspension Lord blunkett is calling for happens I give it a month.
And cowardice
3. The BBC national news on BBC One will have the lowest viewer numbers ever this evening.
Media backing Farage more than ever......I am already feeling nervous about a Reform landslide in 29. Nothing seems to be standing in their way.
😢
I mean, part of Sam's point I think is that the media aren't so much "backing" him (although some definitely are, of course) as they are simply ... covering him, because there's literally nothing coming from the govt. to counteract it.
I fear most of the print media are actually backing him though. & Sky seems to have gone quite right wing recently. The BBC has always platformed him disproportionately - part of the reason why Brexit happened and can never be truly contested. It's utterly depressing
Everything about the last Tory government was a smash and grab. IDK what they thought was going to happen.
If every summer is going to be characterised by rightwing harassment of public spaces or worse, and government is unwilling to challenge it, that’s the sort of thing that will lead to people thinking seriously about whether this is still a country they want to build lives, careers and families in.
They're not paralysed, they're lining their pockets and given up on good governance. Called it so long before now having a Premier with the constitution of a weathervane.
Are Labour just out of step with public opinion. Was the 24 GE win partly because 'ppl' wanted major change? Labour look like they've done nothing and could be now viewed as similar to Sunak's gov. Reform seem to offer something to some ppl. Media doesn't help and the gov have lost there as well.
Ppl want change and the gov aren't telling them why they can't have dramatic change as they seem to be scared of their own shadow. Utterly pathetic. Anyone got any an answers? (wrong answer is Corbyn).
People Not Looking or Listening
partly no cut through as well?
Can’t disagree however we have wilful blindness being promoted too by media. Do you think?
Absolutely agree.
Re: the problem with deliverism. Even if Labour do stop the boats, it won't stop Farage pretending it's a crisis. Any more than London's historically low crime rate stops him claiming it's a dangerous hellhole. He trades in straw men issues because they benefit him, not because they're true.
It's becoming a summer tradition - all politics stops and Nigel Farage becomes the supply PM for a month.
Only this year about 70% of the national press were salivating over him and practically begging for civil disorder.
Glasman’s Labour … paralysed by agreement with Farage.
The Labour leadership now have nothing to lose. If they mount a full on attack on the fascists and it fails they are no worse off than they are now. They will at least recover their integrity and feel better about themselves. Just hoping something turns up is a recipe for certain defeat in 2029.
I hope the media give complete airtime to the Green Party next time they announce a major policy after all they both have 4 MPs #HiddenAgenda
The whole disquiet point of rebellion has been played up by agitators and the press have fed it. Most people find their towns and cities the same as always. Unless you want to walk down the Kings Road with jewellery on. Oh and he’s not the establishment just their shill .
Regardless of whether you support labours economic policy, he dismissed the chancellor as Rachel from accounts yet when asked how he knew his figures were sound said his donor, Dodge man was good at maths. Journalists not in the pay of the right wing need to step up, instead of feeding the drama
I will never understand how this man succeeds in controlling the narrative he got his Brexit without being in government , now he’s destroying the Tories and hoping Labour are paralysed into dancing to his tune. We are four years out from an election or not if you believe Farage
But it's hard for the Tories without a leader. What? Badenoch? Ha ha ha.
The people of England need to stand up to creep THE NIGEL that has the backing of the right wing media barons and the people that follow THE NIGEL are the ones that will suffer the most he is leading them to disaster with no way back the but THE NIGEL won’t suffer he will be well paid and gone
You don't need to launch a full bore defence of liberal internationalism to be able to question the ethics of sending refugees to their certain deaths.
I like frameworks and the Cynefin Framework helps me think about the responses to challenges like immigration and where people like Farage and Starmer are framing their response in the public domain.
If the lie isn't countered the lie lives and flourishes. There is a positive story to be told about migration alongside an honest appraisal of how we got here and how to fix it for the good of all. Instead ALL our politicians feed the monster and the monster is Farage.
Just do the thought experiment of sending Farage and his policies back to the 1930s. Children straight off the Kindertransport sent straight back to Germany and to certain death.
No, but you need to look like you have a plan that will reduce numbers. ‘Smash the gangs’ doesn’t appear to be working.
You cant. That's the reality of the modern world. Climate change is driving people further north due to resource shortages, wars, famines and compounded by billionaires hoovering up all the capital to effectively redress it. This is a mass migration northwards. I told people they need to prepare.
That's the insidiousness of the whole plot. Social media companies supporting mass migration on the emigration end and its opposite on the immigration end, trying to force flash points and diminish everyone's capacity to resist Globo corporate fascism
The fact that on the one hand the government cozies up to Silicon Valley when they are actively attempting to dismantle it is kind of a mind fuck tbh and showcases how little the government has any institutional understanding of the problems of the day OR its corruption which is waaay more likely.
The legislation hasn’t been passed by Parliament yet, it’s in the Lords
Then they really should get a move on. It would also be helpful to get on the front foot and communicate why this is going to work.
Yes the Lords should but it’s not entirely within the Government’s control. I think they also don’t want to overpromise what impact this and the France returns deal will have, and end up underdelivering. But agree they should be setting out more clearly their multi-pronged approach
It's past time to accept who the Labour leadership are.
What? Cowards?
Worse - “Politicians”.
There's nothing wrong with politicians as a category. Someone needs to balance the many competing demands in a society, the alternative is people killing each other. But the current crop of UK MPs appear to have forgotten that persuasion and moral courage are key qualities of a good politician
It’s felt like a very long time since we’ve had anyone with those qualities at the upper echelons of British politics.
:))
Callous and probably stupid
If there's any attempt at mass deportations, there will be mass opposition and I mean "normal people" .... especially as the hotel-harassers are usually outnumbered by counter demonstrators.
I think Reform voters need to have a little think about how much Farage's plans will cost. How much does it cost to return people to a country that might not want to accept them? Farage's plan might well be too expensive to apply. Will Reform voters want their taxes increased to pay for this?
I have always voted Labour (I’m 58) and did so for Corbyn through gritted teeth. I should be happy with this Government but if (when) they lose the next election they will have deserved to. I don’t know what they lack most; vision, communication skills, political antennae or compassion. It’s all 4
The Tories are dead, they have an irrelevant leader and no ideas, and a legacy of moving the country backwards in the last 15 years. Labour's only concern is retaining the racist red wall vote so they want to distance themselves from migrants, brown people as much as they can.
I just can't get my head into wtf Labour is thinking. You have a massive majority and the definitional bully pulpit. Do something!!!!
The latter point is very alarming. If Starmer’s Cabinet of ‘wimpy apologists for racists’ can’t find enough vertebrae between them to form a single spine they must sink back into the primordial soup & allow those Labour MPs who have evolved principles to do the job properly!
Surely they're just taking a break before sacking off Kemi and welcoming back Boris to save the day?
I cannot believe the UK Government has left a massive void this summer and allowed Reform to fill it. The naivety by Labour is like thinking Douglas Ross is liked
Point one is certainly true and the Tories do appear to be lost in a death spiral. On point 2 I do not understand why the government is being so quiet. Reform are essentially exposing themselves to multiple avenues of attack. I don't understand the inaction
Labour had at least 3 days to prepare for today, since the Times outlined what the Reform proposal would look like. It's utterly incompetent to have no rebuttal message to deliver with that much notice.
Labour need an @alastaircampbell2.bsky.social figure to organise the Downing Street response. McSweeney &Co not up to it. Timid.
Much worse than timid I fear.
I increasingly suspect it's not timidity, but agreement. These aren't left wing politicians chasing right wing votes as misguided strategy - they're right wing politicians selling their policies to the left as "pragmatism".
Where's Malcolm when you need him...
Occasionally, just occasionally, silence is golden as far as Nige Ferrrrrage is concerned. Like my old Dad used to say, only rise to the bait if your life depends on it 🫣
The lives of many of us actually do depend on it!!
Farage said it himself .. politics is all about selling .. he’s selling fear and for his racist followers they are loving his summer time specials Meanwhile Labour too busy placating Trump when they should be concentrating on our own mini Trump - Farage - scary times 🥴
Utterly depressing, just how far the bandwidth for acceptable discussion of this topic has shifted in such a short time.
Not sure why Labour, or anyone for that manner, just doesnt talk to Farage like you would any other idiot who insists on hogging the end of the bar?!?
Best to get this out of the way now.
We need more of this journalism. bsky.app/profile/scot...
This is leadership: working for everyone in your nation #Scotland #AllJockTamsonsBairns bsky.app/profile/john...
Bollocks. Starmer is pandering to Farage because they both believe in the same thing.
Two points that need communication that has nothing to do with the main parties 1. Brexit so it’s Farage fault 2. He wants to give tax payers money to Iran and the Taliban
Third point, the media is complicit in creating the difficulties for the government.
Yes. I fear Labour are going to keep on down the road of wearing Deform's clothes and so by helping to promote the far-right talking points.
Farage is all Slogans and no substance His slogans plays people’s fears
In the complete void of any good leader, the far right find a way of creeping in. Scary times.
I am enraged as a labour party member, I feel totally powerless to affect change. It's like an alien life form has taken hold of these people and is choking the sense and morality out of them
People without empathy or principles often have the appearance of alien life forms.
Leave. I did, joined the Greens. Labour didn’t care two hoots at me leaving.
The greens aren't serious until they can solve the contradictions between the their nimby degrowth wing and their youthful abundance wing.
And frankly I'm a liberal, neither wing or then suits me
Start by leaving labour
I wouldn't tell you to leave the party most likely to stop the National Front so don't tell me to leave the party most likely to stop Reform.
Solidarity! Decent people need to stay in The LP. It's an essential part of any anti - fascist coalition.
The thing most likely to stop Reform is PR, which Labour Party members voted for, but Starmer refuses to accept.
Labour right now is not the party that is stopping Reform but the party that is paving the way for a Reform takeover.
It's the only party that can theoretically stop Reform if it gets its shit in order. There is quite literally nothing else aside from hoping the Tories pull back from the brink.
This unfortunately won‘t happen with Starmer as leader. He has planted himself firmly on the side of „concerned citizens“ that are harassing refugees across the country.
Yes we'll he can be replaced faster than another party can be built. There's one show on the road here.
When have Labour party members *ever* removed a leader?
Members can't remove a leader, only MPs can.
And let's face it, why would the little people be entitled to have a view?
There is no chance to replace Starmer anytime soon. He has a right grip on the party machine.
He can be replaced whenever MPs become unconvinced he's going to be able help them keep their seat. I imagine the 2026 local elections give a decent time for this. What exactly is your alternative timo? Pretend Jeremy Corbyn can spin a party of malcontents up? Pretend the greens can win?
Bring in PR to ensure there can not be a Fascist take over of the UK. Labour members voted for it.
The plp failed to remove corbyn cos, y'know, lp rules mean it's virtually impossible to remove a leader no matter how shit he is. Hence 2019.
We’re in this mess because of this kind of thinking. Labour clearly are not doing enough to win the next election or beat away Reform. They’re paving the way. The alternative starts when you stop giving unconditional support to people who are acting like fascists. It’s as simple as that.
why do you think it is that you believe Starmer is firmly on the side of those harassing refugees across the country, and yet those very same people believe Starmer has established a two-tier justice system that singles them out for draconian persecution, where they are 'political prisoners'?
That's not hard. Because Starmer isn't coming out to forcefully oppose these things, and because the right have lost their ever loving minds.
so if Starmer isn't coming out to forcefully oppose these things, why do the people doing those things despise Starmer and believe he is abusing his power to create a two-tier justice system that persecutes and silences them as political prisoners?
Because the right works on the principle of the friend enemy distinction. They select and enemy and organise against it. What you are essentially asking is 'why are Starmers far right political opponents dishonest and cynical' and I mean, I don't know what to tell you bud?
Starmer is afraid of bleeding votes to Reform. He thinks when pushed liberals will vote for Labour no matter what. So it is the Reform vote he has to go after. But all he does is making Farage more electable by pivoting to the same slogans and the liberals will go to Lib Dem or Greens.
He's making the bet that because libs are packed into cities he can lose 2 to the left for every 1 to the right. Libs suffer from being inefficient. The progressive eighth of the country is even more packed into fewer constituencies
But what he needs is the swing suburbs. Labour only won here because of Lib Dem voters lending their votes to Labour where efficient to do so. No chance that he gets this coalition back.
ok, and what about my question?
You clearly don't need lots of mps to set the national agenda, or influence public opinion and government policy. As evidenced by reform who only have 4! We're 4 years from an election, even if you think Labour winning that is the least bad option, it doesn't follow you have to support them now.
join.greenparty.org.uk
Starmer has got to start thinking about his position, we need to be better
At this time, Labour is desperately failing the nation. There’s zero in the way of counter messaging. At best, it’s just the same but moderated message. The country needs immigration. It’s not a want but a need but xenophobia triumphs and then everyone decries the country’s decline. Sickening.
The role of media in this - especially the main broadcast media - in not challenging what is obvious stupidity, is the biggest failure, though. Democracy can only be successful with a strong, fair media.
At best the media is largely supine and gives the public what it perceives it ‘wants to hear’ rather than what is accurate/truthful, especially in respect of consequences. Then terrible results are blamed on everyone but themselves.
BBC News are repeating their Brexit trick of not commenting on the obvious lies or exaggerated claims. As with Brexit their failure to challenge is a big part of the problem.
Exactly. BBC editorial policies and false equivalence has been a grave disaster.
BBC making Farage's announcement the number 1 story, this is a vague policy announcement from a failed political leader with just 4 MPs. The complicity of the BBC in amplifying the reform message is disgraceful.
R4's WatO today should've been retitled The Nigel Farage Show: well over 1/2 the prog featuring uncritical coverage of Faggy's morning spewings, which they justify by saying Deform are 'creating the political weather' but not acknowledging how the BBC keep providing him a outsized platform to do so.
6 o’clock news similar by the sound of it. I turned off after 12 minutes of it.
I managed about ten minutes of PM until Evan Davies gave a govt spokesperson a grilling on immigration by declaring that it didn't "feel like" things are improving. And he calls himself an economist.
Labour is not paralysed with indecision and fear. It has a Labour Cabinet that is wholly bought & corrupted, by private interests. They are committed to implementing policies supported by Tories, the F-R and anti-muslim racists. UK unions & Party members need to step up. Starmer is not on our side
I wonder if it’s that they are gearing up for a defining Autumn. A successful budget and perhaps something big like an ID card announcement. A sort of counter attack strategy - let Reform have the stage then around conference time go big.
Been kind of busy internationally At least not as bad as the lettuce or other #toryboy pms
"2. Labour look even more lost than before. Paralysed with indecision and fear." Just like over Brexit. No plan no balls.
Labour will be judged by results not by words, the next 3 years are going to be crucial for them and us . Failure will see Farage triumph in the next GE , and we only have to look across the pond to see how that'll play out .
Farage says ‘get in the gutter with me’ and Starmer ignores him.
Exactly.
Absolutely right. The weird thing with Labour is that there are so many easy wins on how Reform have been pushing this that they are ignoring. Is it just as simple as they're all on X and have missed its move to being a far right conspiracy site, so are reacting as if it's somehow representative?
The simple answer is they don't differ substantially on the points in question
The policies differ massively, even though the public announcements don't. Which is still hugely disappointing and depressing, ofc.
I'm afraid I'm at see what they actually do, rather than say.
And they are not, as Farage will do when in power because the centre/centre-left/left vote is so split, rounding up people from the streets to deport them. The government's stance is sickening, and leaving many to feel they cannot vote Labour, feeding into a process that only helps Farage.
All governments (ironically, apart from the last Tory one) have removed people from the country whose asylum claims have been turned down. The reason it's so many is the government is now processing the claims of those held in hotels, which for the past 4 years had not been processed.
The last Tory government made it illegal to assess the claims of people who arrived through irregular routes - i.e. the small boats. So they just built up in hotels. The current government is getting through the backlog.
